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Old 02-05-2013, 09:28 PM   #31
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Default Re: Ben Roethlisberger is our John Elway

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Cut the shit, I'm still waiting on you to intelligently back-up the post that I still call bullshit. Can you do that please?
OK, sure...


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This is total bullshit, check the stats of our Wrs and the top-tier teams you're referencing and I think you'll realize that.

Two of ours were All-Pro last year and the year before we were in the SB (lost); won it in 2009. Check the stats over the five year period and come back and post an intelligent response.
Except the last Steelers WR to be named an All-Pro was Hines Ward in 2004. Nobody has done it since. The 2012 All-Pro WRs are Calvin Johnson, Brandon Marshall, A.J. Green and Andre Johnson.

Antonio Brown has 2,062 receiving yards and seven TD receptions in the last three seasons. That's an average of 687.3 yards and 2.3 TD receptions per season. Mike Wallace has 4,042 receiving yards and 32 TD passes in the last four seasons. That's an average of 1,010.5 yards and eight TD receptions per season.

Wallace has had two 1,000-yard receiving seasons in his first four (2010, 2011), and Brown has had one 1,000-yard receiving season in his first three (2011). Neither one had 1,000 receiving yards last season, and the most in a season by either is 1,257 by Wallace in 2010. As far as TDs go, the most by either in a season has been 10, again by Wallace in 2010.

Hines Ward had 3,346 yards and 20 TD receptions in his final four seasons. That's an average of 836.5 yards and five TD receptions per season. Santonio Holmes had 2,069 receiving yards and 10 TD receptions in his last two seasons with the Steelers. That's an average of 1,034.5 yards and five TD receptions per season. Only one of those last two seasons (2009) was a 1,000-yard season for him.

None of the above are All-Pro numbers.


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Some of you said that Arians offense sucked, yet you expect the wrs to be great, then we get the dink and dunk which produced about 1000 less yards that his teams did, again its the wrs fault.
Arians' offense sucked because it never took into account the strengths and weaknesses of the different units of the offense. The offensive line has been mediocre at best for five years, but Arians never adjusted. And the fact that Colts fans complained about Andrew Luck taking a lot of unnecessary abuse illustrates that this ain't a Roethlisberger problem; it's an Arians problem. Ain't many branches less than 10 yards downfield on his route trees.

Hines Ward blames the WRs too. That means he agrees with me and disagrees with you.


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When it comes to Ben's failures, its, you guessed it the wrs fault yet again and of course the Oline. Football is a TEAM sport.
Absolutely. Give a great QB mediocre weapons and protection, and his passer rating will never get out of the 90's from one season to the next.


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Miss me with the stupid shit man.
I see you're from Georgia too. With any luck, we'll never cross paths.

Last edited by Gnutella; 02-05-2013 at 09:43 PM.
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Old 02-05-2013, 11:32 PM   #32
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Default Re: Ben Roethlisberger is our John Elway

OP Hell of a post!!! Kudos to you, sir. Damn... what a post.

(Mods, I submit that for post-of-the-week).
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Old 02-05-2013, 11:43 PM   #33
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Default Re: Ben Roethlisberger is our John Elway

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Except the last Steelers WR to be named an All-Pro was Hines Ward in 2004. Nobody has done it since. The 2012 All-Pro WRs are Calvin Johnson, Brandon Marshall, A.J. Green and Andre Johnson.
Being named an "All-pro" is like going to the Probowl-- it is a popularity contest often won on reputation alone. Being an All-Pro is not bad-- but it is hardly debate fodder or evidence.

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Antonio Brown has 2,062 receiving yards and seven TD receptions in the last three seasons.
He also earned the honor of being the first to rack up 1000 yards receiving and on kick returns. Other than a few bad plays this season, Brown has been electrifying and worth every penny they gave him.

If you recall, Holmes did far less in his first two seasons. it took him until 2007 to finally start showing his playmaking ability.

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That's an average of 687.3 yards and 2.3 TD receptions per season.
If they don't throw the ball his direction, I don't see how he is supposed to earn fantasy stats. I think it is safe to say Mike Wallace took a lot of touches away from more worthy receviers this season.

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Mike Wallace has 4,042 receiving yards and 32 TD passes in the last four seasons. That's an average of 1,010.5 yards and eight TD receptions per season.
Which are not bad numbers. Not worth the $15 million he wanted, but not the disaster you are trying to make them out to be.

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Hines Ward had 3,346 yards and 20 TD receptions in his final four seasons. That's an average of 836.5 yards and five TD receptions per season. Santonio Holmes had 2,069 receiving yards and 10 TD receptions in his last two seasons with the Steelers. That's an average of 1,034.5 yards and five TD receptions per season. Only one of those last two seasons (2009) was a 1,000-yard season for him.
LOL. You are comparing Ward's last 4 seasons to the other guys' first 3? Why does that not seem like a fair or logical comparison to me?

Wouldn't it make more sense to compare Ward's first 4 years to the first 4 years of our current receivers? Ward's numbers his first three seasons were nothing to write home about either. People were calling him a bust in 1999.

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Absolutely. Give a great QB mediocre weapons and protection, and his passer rating will never get out of the 90's from one season to the next.
Comedy. Big Ben took us to and won SB XL with the likes of Nate Washington (stone hands), Cedric WIlson (wife beater who finished the year with less than 600 yards), and Willie Reid (who?).

Going forward, I am thinking that Antonio Brown, Sanders, Cotchery and whomever they get to replace Wallace form a pretty solid WR corps.
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Old 02-06-2013, 12:01 AM   #34
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Default Re: Ben Roethlisberger is our John Elway

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Bronco fans don't treat their QBs like shit the way Steeler fans do. Bronco fans loved Tim Tebow. Steeler fans hated Terry Bradshaw.
I don't think you know what you're talking about. Tebow was an anomaly.
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Old 02-06-2013, 12:18 AM   #35
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I don't think you know what you're talking about. Tebow was an anomaly.
Doesn't change the fact that Steeler fans treat their QBs like shit. If Terry Bradshaw didn't feel welcome in Pittsburgh until five years ago, then that speaks very poorly of us.
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Old 02-06-2013, 12:30 AM   #36
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Default Re: Ben Roethlisberger is our John Elway

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Being named an "All-pro" is like going to the Probowl-- it is a popularity contest often won on reputation alone. Being an All-Pro is not bad-- but it is hardly debate fodder or evidence.
Well he said our WRs were "All-Pro," which they weren't. Now who's bullshitting whom?


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He also earned the honor of being the first to rack up 1000 yards receiving and on kick returns. Other than a few bad plays this season, Brown has been electrifying and worth every penny they gave him.
Roethlisberger only had a few bad plays this season, but that hasn't stopped people from shitting on him anyway.


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If you recall, Holmes did far less in his first two seasons. it took him until 2007 to finally start showing his playmaking ability.
That's fine; it doesn't change the fact that he hasn't had a 1,000-yard receiving season since he left the Steelers. What a coincidence.


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Which are not bad numbers. Not worth the $15 million he wanted, but not the disaster you are trying to make them out to be.
I never said he was a disaster, just overrated. He really is not as good as people say he is. He loses focus too easily; he never fights for the ball, and he's still a sloppy route-runner at times. Mike Tomlin didn't call him a "one-trick pony" for nothing.


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LOL. You are comparing Ward's last 4 seasons to the other guys' first 3? Why does that not seem like a fair or logical comparison to me?
I was asked to look at the WRs' statistics over the last five seasons. That period of time coincides with Hines Ward's last four. I was only doing what I was told.


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Comedy. Big Ben took us to and won SB XL with the likes of Nate Washington (stone hands), Cedric WIlson (wife beater who finished the year with less than 600 yards), and Willie Reid (who?).
Willie Reid was drafted in 2006, and, thus, was not with the team en route to Super Bowl XL. Roethlisberger also had a much better offensive line and running game at the time, which catered to one of his strengths: his play-action passing is lethal. It can't be lethal if nobody respects the run, and nobody has respected the run in the last five years.


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Going forward, I am thinking that Antonio Brown, Sanders, Cotchery and whomever they get to replace Wallace form a pretty solid WR corps.
They still need a tall, physical WR for a change. Emmanuel Sanders is a perennial slot WR, and neither he nor Antonio Brown can beat press coverage reliably.
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Old 02-06-2013, 12:37 AM   #37
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Default Re: Ben Roethlisberger is our John Elway

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Being named an "All-pro" is like going to the Probowl-- it is a popularity contest often won on reputation alone. Being an All-Pro is not bad-- but it is hardly debate fodder or evidence.
I think "All-Pro" is much more crediable than "Pro Bowl". Unlike a popularity contest like "Pro Bowl", "All-Pro" gets it right most of the time.
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Old 02-06-2013, 12:58 AM   #38
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Default Re: Ben Roethlisberger is our John Elway

Nice post. It was a great read.

Oh, and....Ben haters incoming.
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Old 02-06-2013, 03:18 AM   #39
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Default Re: Ben Roethlisberger is our John Elway

Elway was not a great quarterback. Elway was an average quarterback who had a lot of game-winning drives.

Elway did come through in the clutch some of the time. Elway also played like complete garbage in many of the biggest games of his career.

Let's not look at his record setting abyssmal performances in the postseason because there are so many to look at we'd be here forever.

Let's look at what he did in the 98 and 99 Superbowl runs.

Elway threw 6 tds and 3 ints in 7 games. Meanwhile Terrell Davis ran for 11 tds over the same period of time. Terrell Davis ran for more than 100 yards in all 7 games.

Should Elway have won in 98? His stat line of 123 yards 0 tds and 1 ints would say no. But Terrell Davis' stat line of 157 yards and 3 tds said yes.

It is ironic to see people praising Shanahan's open offense as the reason Elway had success under him- when the actual reason that Elway and the Broncos were successful is that TD ran the ball 30 times per game and did it very well.

John Elway... 59th rated passer all-time... on every homer's top 5 list!!! Truly one of the greats!!!

Elway had 2 Probowl WRs, a HOF TE and a HOF RB when he won his Superbowls and all I ever hear is Elway didn't have anyone to throw to. Guess what? As soon as Brian Griese took over Elway's receivers looked amazing. Too bad TD was through due to injury or the Broncos would have had another Superbowl win and I could hear how great Brian Griese was. Brian Griese is the higher rated passer after all.

Broncos homers are the exact same as Steelers homers. Point taken.
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Old 02-06-2013, 06:35 PM   #40
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Default Re: Ben Roethlisberger is our John Elway

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OK, sure...

Except the last Steelers WR to be named an All-Pro was Hines Ward in 2004. Nobody has done it since. The 2012 All-Pro WRs are Calvin Johnson, Brandon Marshall, A.J. Green and Andre Johnson.
I stand corrected in the All-Pro comment (see I can admit when I mis-type) that should have been Pro Bowlers. Matter of fact only Pouncey (on the offensive side) has made All-Pro recently. Wallace, Ben and Brown were Pro Bowlers in 2011.

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Ben Roethlisberger has had the worst weapons of any top-tier QB in the NFL in the last five years. The offensive line and RBs have been mediocre if not downright bad, and the WRs have been overrated. Heath Miller and Maurkice Pouncey have literally been the only other players on offense who have been consistently good.
Still waiting on you to back up that original post but I will respond to some of what you last posted.

Ben has not had the worst weapons on any top-tier QBs in the NFL the last five years. Who are the top-tiered QBs and their teams you have in mind?

Remember we have two SB appearances in the last five years, won one and should have won the other one if we didnít turn the ball over. Iím sure you can recall the fumbles and the pics that cost us that one. We've won quite a few games with a lack of weapons on the offensive side of the ball, haven't we?

And about crossing paths, the feelingís mutual.
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