I'll say it plainly - anyone questioning Big Ben is an IDIOT

[Steelers5895]

Originally Posted by LayingTheWoodley56

I was just going to quote this one to. It's sad how many "fans" seem to glory in criticizing our players, rather than rooting for them. It really feels like some people root for Ike, Ben, Wallace and others to fail so they can run on here and type about what crap they are. I'm not saying that criticism is not warranted on many occasions, but it sucks to see how many people seem to revel in it.

Right down to the fans who complain about our Super Bowl victories because the championship wasn't won in the perfect way they wanted.

There is nothing wrong with critizing players and it doesnt make anyone less of a fan or a bandwagon rider. I am a Steelers fan since 1978 but I am VERY critical of players and I give reasons why.

What I think is worse is the love affair steelers fans get with players and dont look at their performance objectively.

I think Ben gets a free pass. he is playing with house money, kind of like Jeter on on the Yankees. he has done enough for the team, organization and fans.

he has 2 super bowl wins, playoff wins and we know going into any game we can win because he is our QB. To me that is a great feeling to have.

he has played hurt and showed a toughness you dont see from the QB position.

I never once questioned or will question an NFL players toughness or downplay an injury as every human body is different. he has given his all.

Ben is a "cusp" hall of famer and if he wins one more he is a lock. Any complaints is obsurd.

[SteelersCanada]

Welcome! Let me introduce you to the sect known as 'SteelerNation'. We're a spoiled bunch and after one season - a .500 season, mind you - we question Tomlin and Roethlisberger, both of whom are Super Bowl champions. But, if we don't go 12 - 4 / 13 - 3 every single year while picking between 28 - 32, we have to blow up the franchise because, well, we're spoiled.

People who are saying a) Flacco is better than Roethlisberger and b) we should trade Ben are flat out stupid. Every fanbase has them and you're seeing ours. That's all.

[steelfury02]

yup - those of us saying we'd like to see even more out of Ben are certainly not wanting anyone else over him either nor do we under appreciate what he's accomplished - that is nucking futs

Ben has shown the capability to be a student on the game on top of his unorthodox style that no one can replicate, and certainly, no one else can say their QB is as tough as Ben - I take him 100% of the time - but damnit, when I see games like the 11' Patriots game, and the start of this past season where he is finding 10 different receivers and killing defenses with efficiency (I'm not saying we shouldn't go vertical - just not so much as under Arians IMO - especially with our O-line's history) I just can't help but say "That is a flash of Ben that is even better than he ever has been - and that is S_C_A_R_Y - more please."

I want to see Ben kill with efficiency, and then, when his 10 targets (ridiculous options when people are healthy and are allowed to click over time) aren't available he can scramble around like a mad man and make that impossible 3rd down play whenever the hell he wants. Ben has the potential to be top 5 (of all time) in the conversation and his flashes of an added capability gets me excited - that's all.

[MACH1]

How many of you armchair quarterbacks have tried throwing a football at a professional level a few weeks after separating your shoulder and a rib?

[Steelers5895]

Originally Posted by MACH1

How many of you armchair quarterbacks have tried throwing a football at a professional level a few weeks after separating your shoulder and a rib?

yep, and that is why i never question is someone is injured or how injured, etc. we are all different.

[cowherpower]

Originally Posted by wwhickok

I agree completely. I am just saying that if you are going t cticize him, make sure its applied in the right place. I. Would not want ANY other QB including Tom Brady, Drew brees, or Aaron Rodgers. Yes I am dead serious.

I can understand supporting and liking Ben as the Steelers starting QB but you'd really rather have Ben than a young Luck, RG3, Kaepernick...all who have another 12-15 years or a better NOW QB in Brady or Rodgers? Well, that is going a little too far imho

[cowherpower]

Originally Posted by steelfury02

yup - those of us saying we'd like to see even more out of Ben are certainly not wanting anyone else over him either nor do we under appreciate what he's accomplished - that is nucking futs

Ben has shown the capability to be a student on the game on top of his unorthodox style that no one can replicate, and certainly, no one else can say their QB is as tough as Ben - I take him 100% of the time - but damnit, when I see games like the 11' Patriots game, and the start of this past season where he is finding 10 different receivers and killing defenses with efficiency (I'm not saying we shouldn't go vertical - just not so much as under Arians IMO - especially with our O-line's history) I just can't help but say "That is a flash of Ben that is even better than he ever has been - and that is S_C_A_R_Y - more please."

I want to see Ben kill with efficiency, and then, when his 10 targets (ridiculous options when people are healthy and are allowed to click over time) aren't available he can scramble around like a mad man and make that impossible 3rd down play whenever the hell he wants. Ben has the potential to be top 5 (of all time) in the conversation and his flashes of an added capability gets me excited - that's all.

you had me until 'student of the game'. That would be the last thing I would call Ben. In fact I would say that is THE one thing other than hitting the gym that is preventing him from being one of all time best.

[Gnutella]

Originally Posted by Steeldude

There is nothing wrong with questioning any player on the roster.

There's a difference between questioning a player and being disappointed in him, and bashing a player. Too many Steeler fans cross that line, especially with QBs. As far as I'm concerned, the only thing Ben Roethlisberger does wrong is not throw the ball away enough. Dumb QBs don't have only 1.99% of their passes intercepted over a three-year span. Uncoachable QBs don't learn a whole new system of offense in one off-season.

As for reading defenses, I've heard Cris Collinsworth say during a game (paraphrased), "He went through all his progressions and then some; that was his sixth read there, which was actually just him going from his fifth read back to his first again." Another announcer, I forget whom, illustrated Roethlisberger missing an open man by explaining that the open man was his first look, and he'd already moved on in his progressions before his man got open, then got flushed out of the pocket away from him. That doesn't sound like somebody who can't read defenses to me.

By the way, Aaron Rodgers has been sacked at a higher rate than Roethlisberger over the last three seasons, and that's with a somewhat better offensive line to boot. And though there's no doubt that Peyton Manning is smarter, I honestly cannot recall Roethlisberger throwing back toward the hashmarks from the sideline the way Manning did on his last throw of this past season (the overtime INT against the Ravens in the playoffs). What an idiotic throw that was.

Originally Posted by LayingTheWoodley56

Are you actually suggesting that we trade our franchise quarterback at 30 years old (who, I will say again, was having a near-MVP caliber season before his injury) for a 4th-round pick who had one decent drive? That is the dumbest fucking thing I've ever heard in my entire life. Lets see what the reaction is in Pittsburgh if that happens.

It'll be elation in the neighborhoods and suburbs with a below-average concentration of college degrees. Then when he fucks up, they'll call in to 93.7 The Fan and say, "See? This is why he wasn't drafted in the same round as RGIII!"

[Gnutella]

Originally Posted by MACH1

How many of you armchair quarterbacks have tried throwing a football at a professional level a few weeks after separating your shoulder and a rib?

The answer is zero.

They say it takes six weeks on average to heal from such an injury. Roethlisberger got injured on November 12. Six weeks after November 12 is December 24, the day after the Steelers were eliminated from the playoffs. Roethlisberger missed three games, and then played poorly in three more games.

# of games missed + # of poor games = # of weeks for rib injury to heal

What a coincidence! Then, in the seventh week post-injury, Roethlisberger threw three TD passes and zero INTs. Maybe it really does take a dislocated rib six weeks to heal like the doctors say!

A QB's livelihood is his arm; he injures the shoulder and rib adjacent to his throwing arm, comes back three weeks before they're expected to be healed, and plays three poor games. Gee, imagine that! Furthermore, in five of his first nine starts he had completion percentages in the 70's, but in his first three games back from his injury, the best he could do was 60%. This ain't hard to figure out.

And I don't blame him for coming back early either because Byron Leftwich is ridiculously fragile, and Charlie Batch just doesn't have it anymore. I bet Roethlisberger will prove next season that his post-injury performance was the aberration instead of his pre-injury performance.

Originally Posted by cowherpower

you had me until 'student of the game'. That would be the last thing I would call Ben. In fact I would say that is THE one thing other than hitting the gym that is preventing him from being one of all time best.

If he's not a "student of the game," then how'd he learn a new system of offense so fast?

[wwhickok]

Originally Posted by cowherpower

I can understand supporting and liking Ben as the Steelers starting QB but you'd really rather have Ben than a young Luck, RG3, Kaepernick...all who have another 12-15 years or a better NOW QB in Brady or Rodgers? Well, that is going a little too far imho

I would rather have Ben than clearly declining Tom Brady, badly injured RG3, and yes, Aaron Rodgers, who Id like to see get hit by a bus.

Id love to have Kaepernick or Luck sure. But would I trade Ben? Honestly I wouldnt.