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Old 02-21-2014, 11:07 AM   #11
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Default Re: Steelers run defense needs help but a nose tackle might not be the answer

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Right, but only 2.0 YPC up the middle, or at McLendon. What was the YPC at the right side of the line, or at Ziggy Hood and rookie Jarvis Jones? It'd be interesting to see what it was against the left and right side, or Heyward and Hood respectively.

I realize that it's not just on Heyward and Hood, but with two defensive ends almost night and day talent wise controlling and sealing gaps, it's worth taking a look. Maybe the issue isn't a legitimate NT, it's another End to play opposite Heyward, and giving Jarvis time to develop.
That other end should be Steve McClendon. Al Woods seems suitable as a NT, but maybe not a legit starter.

Our run defense fell into the twenties-- you have to look at what changed. That being MLB and NT, and yes, ROLB. We cannot minimize the loss of an All-Pro in Harrison.
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Old 02-21-2014, 11:09 AM   #12
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Default Re: Steelers run defense needs help but a nose tackle might not be the answer

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That other end should be Steve McClendon. Al Woods seems suitable as a NT, but maybe not a legit starter.

Our run defense fell into the twenties-- you have to look at what changed. That being MLB and NT.
A 6th round rookie and an out of position player changed, you're right.

I'm not saying that McLendon is the answer at NT. In fact, I've advocated for him to be kicked to DE and a space eating Tackle drafted somewhere in the draft, just not at 15.
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Old 02-21-2014, 11:10 AM   #13
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Default Re: Steelers run defense needs help but a nose tackle might not be the answer

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A 6th round rookie and an out of position player changed, you're right.

I'm not saying that McLendon is the answer at NT. In fact, I've advocated for him to be kicked to DE and a space eating Tackle drafted somewhere in the draft, just not at 15.
I see. Good point.
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Old 02-21-2014, 11:13 AM   #14
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Default Re: Steelers run defense needs help but a nose tackle might not be the answer

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But this is about fixing a run defense that plummeted from top-5 to mid twenties. That starts with the big guy in the middle.

The 3-4 is predicated on making opposing offenses one-dimensional.

We let a QB run 94 yards for a TD this last season for crying out loud. Teams were able to move the ball against us on the ground this year, and it opened up more possibilities for them in the passing game.

I see what you and the article are saying though-- the emphasis on DT/NT has declined in recent years. But even if he's only going to be on the field for 50% of the snaps-- we saw this season how ugly it can be if those snaps are not effective.

Teams weren't running the ball against us in sub-packages this year. They were gashing us right up the middle on early downs
.
1. Blame the poor tackling from the LBs and DBs

2. I understand but the NT position isn't the reason why offenses become one-dimensional, great front 7 play does(you would probably agree but I'm just saying)

2. the 93 yrd td run by Pryor was because of being to aggressive. Gotta go back and look at the play(wish i wasn't reminded lol) but Woodley and Clark are the players should be blamed for that TD run.

4. teams averaged 2.0ypc up the middle when McLendon was in the line up(1st & 2nd downs).

Gotcha but our run defense was very good(for having 2 rookies at LB and Clarks bad tackling) at the end of the season it was the big plays earlier in the season that made us have the 21st ranked run defense
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Old 02-21-2014, 11:16 AM   #15
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Default Re: Steelers run defense needs help but a nose tackle might not be the answer

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The NFL is all about situational football and if you don't have the right players for those situations, you get exposed and abused in that situation. Last year the Steelers got abused at the rate of 4.3 YPC by opponents and run defense starts up front.
with better LB play and better DE play
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Old 02-21-2014, 11:18 AM   #16
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Default Re: Steelers run defense needs help but a nose tackle might not be the answer

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1. Blame the poor tackling from the LBs and DBs

2. I understand but the NT position isn't the reason why offenses become one-dimensional, great front 7 play does(you would probably agree but I'm just saying)

2. the 93 yrd td run by Pryor was because of being to aggressive. Gotta go back and look at the play(wish i wasn't reminded lol) but Woodley and Clark are the players should be blamed for that TD run.

4. teams averaged 2.6ypc up the middle when McLendon was in the line up(1st & 2nd downs).

Gotcha but our run defense was very good(for having 2 rookies at LB and Clarks bad tackling) at the end of the season it was the big plays earlier in the season that made us have the 21st ranked run defense
You couldn't be more wrong Timmons is the one that screwed that play. Woodley and Timmons admitted he was wrong. Wood let's job on that play was to crash down no matter what and timdong was suppose to fill his spot. But I know this board will never say a negative thing about the genius we pay 9 mill a year for
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Old 02-21-2014, 11:18 AM   #17
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Default Re: Steelers run defense needs help but a nose tackle might not be the answer

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I think that any one of McLendon, Woods, Hood to play the other DE would be fine beside Heyward. Still a true NT up the middle that takes up 2 gaps is truly needed.

If teams want to go 4 and 5 wide to take a NT off the field that is fine. Anybody on the front 7 loves when they know its a pass and they can pin back and rush the QB. When there is the threat of a run, they have to play it honest.

I really don't understand why fans bitch about having to take a NT off the field, or if a guy only plays 50% of the time. A.J. Green had 98 receptions last season....he makes 6 PLAYS PER GAME . Nobody complains that a WR only makes a significant impact on 6-10 plays per game, yet they whine about a D Lineman only playing 15-20 snaps.

The NFL is all about situational football and if you don't have the right players for those situations, you get exposed and abused in that situation. Last year the Steelers got abused at the rate of 4.3 YPC by opponents and run defense starts up front.
I'm sorry, but this post reeks of ignorance. First off, the main issue with NT's coming off the field is when the offense is in a THREE wide set, where an extra CB is needed. Having a NT on the field in a three wide set nearly guarantees that the defense will be playing zone. How often do you want a safety manned on a slot receiver with a LB guarding a TE? Furthermore, in a three wide set, the offense still has enough man power up front to successfully run the ball. The three wide set is the most dangerous set on offense because of the multiple ways it can attack the defense.

If you want to run the nickel 3-3-5 when facing a three wide set, then the NT better be able to rush the passer, as you're taking a potential pass rusher off the field in a linebacker. That fourth linebacker also allows you to do more in your coverages.

And a WR does way more than just catch the ball. Come on man that's just a down right stupid comment. You think a defense doesn't account for a stud wide out every play during the game? Do you really think that the only positive impact a receiver can have is when he has the ball in his hands?

The YPC stat is meaningless without context. Youre blaming the starting NT for the 4.3 YPC when he was only on the field for 33% of the defensive snaps last year. I don't think anybody is saying that a good NT isn't a need or that it isn't valuable to a defense. The issue I have with the position is that people believe its such a need that it deserves a day one and even day two pick. It just doesn't. Take a flier on a guy late in the draft, coach him up and feedbhis fat ass and hell be as successful and play as much as thebguy we would have spent the first rounder on.
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Old 02-21-2014, 11:22 AM   #18
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Default Re: Steelers run defense needs help but a nose tackle might not be the answer

I'm not replying to that fuckboy named jb500ex
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Old 02-21-2014, 11:26 AM   #19
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Default Re: Steelers run defense needs help but a nose tackle might not be the answer

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But this is about fixing a run defense that plummeted from top-5 to mid twenties. That starts with the big guy in the middle.

The 3-4 is predicated on making opposing offenses one-dimensional.

We let a QB run 94 yards for a TD this last season for crying out loud. Teams were able to move the ball against us on the ground this year, and it opened up more possibilities for them in the passing game.

I see what you and the article are saying though-- the emphasis on DT/NT has declined in recent years. But even if he's only going to be on the field for 50% of the snaps-- we saw this season how ugly it can be if those snaps are not effective.

Teams weren't running the ball against us in sub-packages this year. They were gashing us right up the middle on early downs.
Argh. The Pryor TD was a DIRECT result of the olb biting on the fake and poor tackling in the secondary. The read option plays are designed to take out the NT and attacks the edges. Save for McClendon jumping the snap and goingnuntoucjed, he has almost no chance to make a play.
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Old 02-21-2014, 11:29 AM   #20
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Default Re: Steelers run defense needs help but a nose tackle might not be the answer

So, what I am hearing is that NT is no longer important in today's 34 defenses? I won't claim to be a football guru-- I only played for a while, but that is interesting.
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