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Old 04-24-2011, 04:33 PM   #11
finesward
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Default Re: Over-emphasis on CBs stopping rush?

Quote:
Originally Posted by thumper View Post
It's like saying, "We like our QBs to be able to block." OK, not quite
that stupid but along the same lines. Get some gad dang CBs who
can cover and make plays.
Well if our offense revolved around disguising run/pass plays a QB that could block would be an asset. You don't seem to get why having CB's that can tackle is important in a defense like dicks. Just think about what would happen if we sent an overload blitz pulling the deep safety and left a CB alone with a WR, and that CB wanted to make a play and jump the quick out, or got stiff armed while trying to make a tackle and that WR trotted untouched to the endzone. How many times has that happened? Besides ike falling down against holmes I can't think of too many.
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Old 04-24-2011, 07:27 PM   #12
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Default Re: Over-emphasis on CBs stopping rush?

we definitely need better cover corners.
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Old 04-24-2011, 08:24 PM   #13
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Default Re: Over-emphasis on CBs stopping rush?

I support having and emphasis on run-stopping CB's, but at the same time coverage skills cannot completely be sacrificed to have such players. We can't be drafting, signing, and starting CB's just because they play the run well, they need to be able to hold their own in coverage as well.

We do need much better coverage CBs, I don't mind sacrificing a little bit of pure man-toman ability for a CB who can stop the run well but I don't want William Gays either. They need to be held to a higher standard and not given a free pass on our team for their runstopping ability.
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Old 04-24-2011, 09:27 PM   #14
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Default Re: Over-emphasis on CBs stopping rush?

If we cant beat Patriots once in awhile then we dont deserve to be in the SB.... You have to beat the best some times.
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Old 04-25-2011, 12:06 PM   #15
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Default Re: Over-emphasis on CBs stopping rush?

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Originally Posted by finesward View Post
Well if our offense revolved around disguising run/pass plays a QB that could block would be an asset. You don't seem to get why having CB's that can tackle is important in a defense like dicks. Just think about what would happen if we sent an overload blitz pulling the deep safety and left a CB alone with a WR, and that CB wanted to make a play and jump the quick out, or got stiff armed while trying to make a tackle and that WR trotted untouched to the endzone. How many times has that happened? Besides ike falling down against holmes I can't think of too many.
No, I understand why _any_ player on defense should be able
to tackle. My point is they end up putting too much weight on DBs
being able to tackle and we end up with stiffs who just blow out
there trying to cover anyone. That is not acceptable.

Keenan Lewis - Garbage.
Joe Burnett - rubbish
Ryan Mundy - Crap
Anthony Smith - Could hit like a monster, but dumber than a rock

I did like the picks of Ike and McFadden though.
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Old 04-25-2011, 12:16 PM   #16
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Default Re: Over-emphasis on CBs stopping rush?

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If we cant beat Patriots once in awhile then we dont deserve to be in the SB.... You have to beat the best some times.
Yup. We beat them twice in recent history - once when they
were without Brady, and the other when we peaked too early
in 2004 and crushed them at Heinze Field, only for them to beat us
when it mattered most in the post season. One of the worst disappointments
in memory. Cowher just crapped his pants once again in the AFCC game.
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Old 04-25-2011, 01:28 PM   #17
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Default Re: Over-emphasis on CBs stopping rush?

It's a great formula to make a team one dimensional, then play the mind games with blitz and coverage packages that result in turnovers. However, with CBs that can't catch and back-ups that can't understand the system, the Steelers can only beat on teams with average-to-weak QBs (hence the Steelers own the AFC North). Ike has to learn to pick a few passes more than 1.2 times per year and B-Mac and Troy need to stay healthy.
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Old 04-25-2011, 02:32 PM   #18
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Default Re: Over-emphasis on CBs stopping rush?

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Originally Posted by kirklandrules View Post
It's a great formula to make a team one dimensional, then play the mind games with blitz and coverage packages that result in turnovers. However, with CBs that can't catch and back-ups that can't understand the system, the Steelers can only beat on teams with average-to-weak QBs (hence the Steelers own the AFC North). Ike has to learn to pick a few passes more than 1.2 times per year and B-Mac and Troy need to stay healthy.
We can't expect Ike to suddenly learn how to catch; if he was going to
learn to make picks he would have long ago. He just has crap hands,
nothing you can do. But a truly healthy B-Mac and TP will go a long,
long way, plus if they draft the kid from TX, we could be in pretty good
shape. I know there are major concerns over having to play a rookie
at starting CB but I think they can simplify that side of the field to help
the new kid out, PLUS, maybe they will actually put a CB there who
_can_ actually catch the ball, and that could be an upgrade, as far
as that portion goes. I think they should go best possible CB round
1 even if they do have Ike return. Looking at the last 10 years of Pgh's
drafting, they have gone pretty weak for CB for a long time - as bad
as how weak they have gone on drafting OL-men when you look at it.

http://www.drafthistory.com/teams/steelers.html

And let's not forget about 1 player who could alter this discussion
and their position: Butler.

They were very high on this guy in camp last year. Maybe he is ready
to break out - he has all the physical skills needed. Anyone know
the status on this guy?
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Old 04-28-2011, 01:07 PM   #19
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Default Re: Over-emphasis on CBs stopping rush?

Quote:
Originally Posted by thumper View Post
We can't expect Ike to suddenly learn how to catch; if he was going to
learn to make picks he would have long ago. He just has crap hands,
nothing you can do. But a truly healthy B-Mac and TP will go a long,
long way, plus if they draft the kid from TX, we could be in pretty good
shape. I know there are major concerns over having to play a rookie
at starting CB but I think they can simplify that side of the field to help
the new kid out, PLUS, maybe they will actually put a CB there who
_can_ actually catch the ball, and that could be an upgrade, as far
as that portion goes. I think they should go best possible CB round
1 even if they do have Ike return. Looking at the last 10 years of Pgh's
drafting, they have gone pretty weak for CB for a long time - as bad
as how weak they have gone on drafting OL-men when you look at it.

http://www.drafthistory.com/teams/steelers.html

And let's not forget about 1 player who could alter this discussion
and their position: Butler.

They were very high on this guy in camp last year. Maybe he is ready
to break out - he has all the physical skills needed. Anyone know
the status on this guy?
Your banking on the same hoop-lah they had about keenan lewis out of camp. Mind you they drafted lewis because he was an ike prototype kind of player, NOT because of his tackling like you love to proclaim b/c you heard it on sportscenter, but because of his SIZE and speed. They wanted him to play bump and run coverage. I hate to break it to ya, but spending a first rounder on Williams is an even bigger gamble b/c essentially he is the same body type/cover corner as Lewis was. So you say, go smaller but have the guy at least be able to catch....WRONG again, they tried that with burnett and he kept getting abused physically.

Your idea that you draft a CB and then simplify things for him so he won't make mistakes and that would make the defense better is to put kindly RETARDED. For this defense to be effective you need established players who know their duties to allow others to perform. When you have guys like madison, or a rookie like williams in there others won't be able to roam free because your having to make things simple for the rook. That's a silly idea, one that lacks any kind of thought behind it, and a simplistic reactionary view that shows you just love to wahhhhhhh about how stupid the front office is and how you would do so much better if you were in charge. Drafting a mid 2nd round talent CB in the 1st round b/c of a need and skipping over 20 players that could be great like most if not all of our recent 1st rounders is STUPID. Williams will never be a great CB or even a very good one. You have to go top 10 to find those players, which astonishingly we haven't had in the past 10 years or whatever you were looking at our draft history. Hmmm....maybe that's because whatever system the front office is using to draft players is WORKING and you know the saying...

I hope they trade up for POUNCEY. Man wouldn't it be great to have the twins play next to each other! It would be sooooooo CUTE!!!!
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Old 04-28-2011, 02:10 PM   #20
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Default Re: Over-emphasis on CBs stopping rush?

Not sure I agree with ya, Finesward. Yes, there are a number of good and great corners who were drafted high. But I believe the Post Gazette had an article on how a large number of the top corners in the league today were mid and lower round draft picks.

Also, I'll sh!t on my pillow and roll my face in it if the Steelers trade up to get Pouncey. I just don't see that happening. I agree that Williams really isn't the best choice and like the idea of trading down into the 2nd.
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