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Old 09-26-2013, 11:57 PM   #11
Gnutella
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Default Re: Is Tomlin Overrated?

I have only two criticisms of Mike Tomlin:


1. He does a poor job of clock management.

2. He might be a little bit too hands-off on Sundays.


Other than that, I think he's been a fine coach. This season will be his biggest challenge, though, so we'll see if he's one of the best or merely decent.
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Old 09-27-2013, 05:14 AM   #12
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Default Re: Is Tomlin Overrated?

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How many nfl coaches have never had a losing season.
Only coaches that get fired before the first season is over.

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Old 09-27-2013, 05:28 AM   #13
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Default Re: Is Tomlin Overrated?

I think Tomlin and the Steelers been victimized by the rule changes in the NFL. When we could smack the shit outta people, it was a lot easier to win games. Now it's all about adjusting while going through the yout movement. Take all that into consideration and Tomlin is doing a fine job.
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Old 09-27-2013, 05:28 AM   #14
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Default Re: Is Tomlin Overrated?

If the question is overrated than I say yes. If you here the media talk he may as well be Jesus reincarnated most of the time but I don't see it. He is a (sometimes) great speaking solid football coach. He has just done so many questionable things that I can't go beyond calling him solid or good at best.

Clock management is a problem many have pointed out so far. But there is something worse than that IMO. And that is knowing his players and what he has to work with. I will give some examples.

1. Shuisam. Last year Tomlin had Shuisam attempt 2 FG's of 54 or more near the end of games when his career long is 52 and we have never seen him come close to more in game. Once it cost us the game when Shuisam fell short 2 or 3 yards and later on Tomlin made the same call and Shuisam missed by 2 or 3 yards but we did manage to win that one. You simply have to know Shuisam can't make that kick. And if you didn't know the first time and it cost us the game you sure as hell shouldn't have made the decision the 2nd time.

2. Running backs. This is a 2 part thing. First is something I mentioned before in other threads but it is how quickly he benches them for mistakes. That is a confidence killer and makes them run scared which makes them run worse which makes the whole thing a snowballing issue. Add to that that he doesn't treat other positions the same way. We have seen Gay get burnt multiple times in a game with no repercussions in previous seasons. Ben has 6 or 7 turnovers in 3 games and there has been no mention of him or his poor play. Receivers can drop balls and miss routes and yet they start. He puts an unfair burden on one group on the team which alienates them.

Part 2 of this is one RB specifically. For the sake of argument let us agree Redman should not be a starting RB. Getting past that, he is great on short yardage and at goal line. In fact he was up around 100% at short yardage conversions at one point last year or the year before. Well why when we get into short yardage positions were we letting Mendenhall and Dwyer fail instead of bringing in Redman who had the most success of the group? The same applies to goal line. Some of Redmans initial fame/reputation amongst the team came from beating our D during goal line drills. They even gave him the nickname of Redzone. So why again were we not using him while our redzone numbers were looking pretty shitty?

These to me are things that keep him from being a great coach. Maybe he is just too set in his ways as a young prideful guy but he doesn't even seem to understand the very tools he brings in to use for himself.
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Old 09-27-2013, 05:32 AM   #15
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Default Re: Is Tomlin Overrated?

Yes he is hugely overrated what exactly makes him a good coach.
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Old 09-27-2013, 05:55 AM   #16
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Default Re: Is Tomlin Overrated?

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Yes he is hugely overrated what exactly makes him a good coach.
2 Super Bowl appearances and 1 Super Bowl victory in 6 years.
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Old 09-27-2013, 07:15 AM   #17
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Default Re: Is Tomlin Overrated?

Overrated? No, over appreciated yeah, good coach, lots of great potential, definitely has the tools to produce Championship teams, but he needs to understand the clock is reset every year a new NFL season starts, you are only as good as your last good deed!
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Old 09-27-2013, 07:53 AM   #18
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Default Re: Is Tomlin Overrated?

Extremely. What is his stamp on the team? He came in 2007 as a Tampa-2 guy preaching a violent running game. 7 years later, we're still running a 3-4 and the running game is in the toilet.

Also, can anyone cite another instance where a new HC took over and didn't hire his own coordinators? Has that ever happened? Bill Cowher took over for a HOF four time SB-winning coach, cleaned house, and implemented the O and D he wanted. He built the team in his image and was prepared to live or die with his choices.

Arians and LeBeau were part of Cowher's staff, and Haley replaced Arians last year against Tomlin's wishes. Something doesn't add up here. It's like they hired a guy and told him to give good interviews but don't touch anything without asking.

When he does get involved with in-game decisions, like when to challenge or not challenge a call, when to attempt or not attempt a FG or 2-pt conversion, clock mgmt, etc., they are almost always the wrong decision.

And if the whole "get rid of productive receivers and pound the rock with Redman/Dwyer/Bell" is part of his dream of a "violent running game", the sooner he goes, the better. This team should be built around its franchise QB, not in spite of him. I've never seen a team do less to support a franchise QB. It's sickening, in fact. They actually put Jonathan Scott out there on Ben's blind side to start a season a couple years ago. Jonathan Scott. That is, until Cowher castoff Max Starks came in and saved the day.

Ditto this year with Adams.

Don't know about anyone else, but I wish we would have kept Starks.

Last edited by maddog78; 09-27-2013 at 08:11 AM.
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Old 09-27-2013, 08:01 AM   #19
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Default Re: Is Tomlin Overrated?

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Originally Posted by EbonySteel86 View Post
I think Tomlin and the Steelers been victimized by the rule changes in the NFL. When we could smack the shit outta people, it was a lot easier to win games. Now it's all about adjusting while going through the yout movement. Take all that into consideration and Tomlin is doing a fine job.
^^^This^^^

I think this description of Tomlin is about as close to reality as any.
Tomlin's pedigree is as a Defensive coach and along with LeBeau -- before the rule changes -- I think he tended to look at the defensive side of the ball as a given.
I think both Tomlin and LeBeau have a similar defensive philosophy (smacking the shit out of people) and prior to the rule changes, they both assumed that getting the ball back or keeping teams from scoring was relatively simple.

But now that it's more about technique and smarts instead of helmet hits and elbow blows, they've both had to put a lot more effort into designing effective defenses and so far it's still a work in progress.

Before the rule changes, all Tomlin and LeBeau needed was a decent offense because the defense used to be able to help keep things from getting out of control. But now, in addition to having to design and effective defense without the clubs and battle axes, he also has to design a more efficient offense as well.

I think this is actually a good thing because I think Tomlin is smart enough to do this and in the end it will make for a better team overall.
The problem of course is having the patience to live through the transition stages.
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Old 09-27-2013, 08:05 AM   #20
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Default Re: Is Tomlin Overrated?

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No.

Tomlin will be a top paid coach in this league as long as he wants and when he moves on he will enjoy even more success if he so desires.

People say the same about cow her and gruden. Don't think they can't step into an 8 mil/ year job whenever they want and don't think tomlins career won't surpass theirs.
Overated and overpaid. He turned the steelers into the browns bro.

He'll be the Raiders head coach after he gets fired in two years. And Ben will be his QB.
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