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Old 06-15-2008, 11:16 AM   #21
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Default Re: Next time you're pumping gas at $4/gallon +.....

Great post, fansince'76. I really think there is some price gouging going on, but our leaders choose to look the other way, and we all know how useless congress is.
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Old 06-15-2008, 11:26 AM   #22
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Default Re: Next time you're pumping gas at $4/gallon +.....

If the government wasn't charging a 50 cent per gallon tax and democrats hadn't voted down and VETOED drilling for our own oil the last 20 years, I wouldn't be surprised if we would be paying less than $2 a gallon right now. This oil company "price gouging" crap is little more than a publicity stunt by the right wing media and the likes of Obama who are playing off the ignorance of the average american for political gain.
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Old 06-15-2008, 04:27 PM   #23
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Default Re: Next time you're pumping gas at $4/gallon +.....

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If the government wasn't charging a 50 cent per gallon tax and democrats hadn't voted down and VETOED drilling for our own oil the last 20 years, I wouldn't be surprised if we would be paying less than $2 a gallon right now. This oil company "price gouging" crap is little more than a publicity stunt by the right wing media and the likes of Obama who are playing off the ignorance of the average american for political gain.
Disagree about the $2. We can't reasonably expect gas to stay at $1 forever...most things get more expensive. With gas, worldwide demand is rising, the dollar is weak, and the easy oil has already been harvested. Drilling offshore or using the Alberta oil sands will produce a supply but it's a lot more expensive than traditional drilling methods.

The gasoline tax is supposed to be dedicated to road maintenance. You think the roads are bad in PA now, imagine if that revenue stream gets cut off. There's a lot of waste like bridges to nowhere in Alaska and West Virginia, but you can't do away with the gas tax.
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Old 06-15-2008, 04:32 PM   #24
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Default Re: Next time you're pumping gas at $4/gallon +.....

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First of all, I agree with you that we need to work on renewablee energy sources, but the key to doing that is to provide incentives both to the manufacurers for developing renewable energy vehicles and to the consumers to purchase them. However in the meantime we need to increase supply. One of the best ways to do that is to drill in the less than 1/2% of anwr to make us less reliant on foreign oil.
Gephardt had a plank in his platform about that when he ran for POTUS. He wanted to offer the automakers pollution permit credits for improving fuel efficiency. Those are highly valuable on the open market. Unfortunately Iowa decided to vote for that douchebag from Massachusetts instead, and winning Iowa means a media blowjob for the rest of the campaign. (Lieberman was my first choice but Gephardt was good on this issue.)
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Old 06-15-2008, 05:24 PM   #25
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Default Re: Next time you're pumping gas at $4/gallon +.....

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Disagree about the $2. We can't reasonably expect gas to stay at $1 forever...most things get more expensive. With gas, worldwide demand is rising, the dollar is weak, and the easy oil has already been harvested. Drilling offshore or using the Alberta oil sands will produce a supply but it's a lot more expensive than traditional drilling methods.

The gasoline tax is supposed to be dedicated to road maintenance. You think the roads are bad in PA now, imagine if that revenue stream gets cut off. There's a lot of waste like bridges to nowhere in Alaska and West Virginia, but you can't do away with the gas tax.
I think those are good points Godfather. However, expectations affect oil prices as well. Just the fact that we were going after our own oil / energy would lower prices. I have heard estimates that if the drilling in Anwar alone had been approved in the late 90's that we'd likely be producing over a million barrels of crude oil a day right now. I would also imagine there would be benefits to the regional economies, and the U.S. as a whole, as well. Any way I look at it, I just I think us having more control and direct involvement in our oil production / supplies is a positive thing. $2 a gallon? Wishful thinking perhaps, but I just hate hearing it implied that oil companies "excessive profits" are the main reason we are at $4 / gallon.
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Old 06-15-2008, 06:05 PM   #26
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Default Re: Next time you're pumping gas at $4/gallon +.....

can someone please explain this one too me ???

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Historically, diesel has often been cheaper than regular gas. But with the rest of the world -- including fast-growing China and India -- so reliant on diesel, U.S. refiners have increased their exports abroad. While European refiners export gasoline to the United States, some tankers return with diesel to fulfill high demand across the Atlantic. Reduced supplies in the United States mean diesel is, on average, about 65 cents per gallon more expensive than gasoline.
why in the hell are we refining oil for other countries when they say the lack of refining capacity in this country is partially to blame for the high prices ???

http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com...nMissouri.aspx
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Old 06-16-2008, 09:25 AM   #27
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Default Re: Next time you're pumping gas at $4/gallon +.....

Ethanol is no solution.

Biodiesel has problems in cold weather. I don't have a source, but I read somewhere about a whole fleet of vehicles engines blowing up because biodiesel viscosity gets all messed up at a certain low temperature.

I hate apologizing for big oil, but they spend a tremendous amount of money on finding new sources of oil, and it's not exactly cheap to extract and refine it when they do. That's why windfall profit taxes are a bad idea.

It's a very complex argument, and I just want to make sure we don't get mired in oversimplified "solutions' that aren't really solutions at all. I think we can all at least a gree that there is a major problem on our hands, though.
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Old 06-16-2008, 09:45 AM   #28
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Default Re: Next time you're pumping gas at $4/gallon +.....

The oil companies control this country. As soon as the oil is gone, the alternative energy sources, cars that run on solar, water, whatever.... will miraculously appear. Problem is the same oil companies will be holding the patents on all the new technology. As stated earlier it still boils down to supply and demand. As long as people are lining up to pay $4 gallon for gas to drive to the lake next weekend it doesn't matter what you burn in the tank. If cars run on kool aid in 10 years. A gallon of kool aid will cost $7

You have no recourse at the pump so do what I do....Swear under your breath cursing GBush while vowing to buy a bicycle next week.
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Old 06-16-2008, 10:12 AM   #29
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Default Re: Next time you're pumping gas at $4/gallon +.....

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The oil companies control this country. As soon as the oil is gone, the alternative energy sources, cars that run on solar, water, whatever.... will miraculously appear. Problem is the same oil companies will be holding the patents on all the new technology. As stated earlier it still boils down to supply and demand. As long as people are lining up to pay $4 gallon for gas to drive to the lake next weekend it doesn't matter what you burn in the tank. If cars run on kool aid in 10 years. A gallon of kool aid will cost $7

You have no recourse at the pump so do what I do....Swear under your breath cursing GBush while vowing to buy a bicycle next week.
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Old 06-16-2008, 12:02 PM   #30
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Default Re: Next time you're pumping gas at $4/gallon +.....

Its easier to control people when they are broke and hungry. So by keeping us dependant on Foriegn oil, and resources, the politicians in charge can keep feeding us cake instead of allowing us to grow our own crops, and bake our own cake.

Next they take will our freedom of speech, which has already started with Political Correctness and McCain Fiengold. They've taken God out of schools, almost to the point of where its "illegal" or at least wrong to wear anything supporting your religion in school. Is that freedom of Religion?

Open borders allow millions of immigrants into a country that they refuse to assimilate into and instead insist on the citizens of the US to accept them as they are and adapt their foriegn cultures be it South American, African, Eastern European, or Asian.

Next, take their guns so they have no way to fight the oppression. Take nearly 40% of their hard earned money and redistribute the wealth evenly to all those not part of the "ruling class".

Keep the sheep blind to the truth and you can lead them to the wolves while reaping the reward of their wool.

I blame them all. All carreer politicians. Its time for change, and I don't mean a political change, its time for all new politicians. Citizens are supposed to run the government, not the other way around.
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