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An important history lesson for you TRUE Steelers fans!

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Old 09-24-2008, 09:30 PM   #21
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Default Re: McCain wants to suspend Fridays debates

Quote:
Originally Posted by steelwall View Post
What do you think Mcain is afraid of? Did Mcain go out and talk to all wall street investors and make them weary of trading? What is Obamas solution to this crisis can you tell me?

I've been following both candidates and I still don't know where Obama stands on practicly anything.

I'm not against a black president, or even a president which has had little experiance, but I at least like to know were that canididate stands on issues.

Obama could be the best thing since sliced bread, but I still have no idea of how he plans to deal with the current economic crisis.

Just seems when it comes to the economy the democrates have an automatic atvantage....why? Am I suposed to vote for Obama because he's a Democrate which gives him a 10 point spread on the economy simply because he's a Democrate? I don't buy it.

Tell me something he's going to do to reverse our economic failings...no sarcasm.. I really want to know..
That is exactly why we are having these debates on Friday. McCain should not be allowed to suspend them. I want to hear what these guys have to say, now.
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Old 09-24-2008, 09:40 PM   #22
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Default Re: McCain wants to suspend Fridays debates

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Originally Posted by steelwall View Post
What do you think Mcain is afraid of? Did Mcain go out and talk to all wall street investors and make them weary of trading? What is Obamas solution to this crisis can you tell me?

I've been following both candidates and I still don't know where Obama stands on practicly anything.

..
then maybe you should just vote for mccain then (although he hasnt offered up any solutions either).

nobody has them as we are in pretty much unchartered water.

it seems like you are asking a single person (or few) on a single message board to sum up and entire candidates platform. that can be dangerous. with the internet, the sources of info are endless.

ive taken in dozens (if not hundereds of viewpoints) to formulate my opinion. left ,right, and to the middle, on both sides of a specific subject.

i would suggest googling "mccains economic advisors" and "obamas economic advisors" and reading alot of articles both for and agains each candidates advisors. i leaned alot by doing that.

sometimes you will come across an article such as this-

Quote:
COMMENTARY

Allison: A conservative for Obama
Wick Allison, D MAGAZINE
Monday, September 22, 2008

The more I listen to and read about "the most liberal member of the U.S. Senate," the more I like him. Barack Obama strikes a chord with me like no political figure since Ronald Reagan. To explain why, I need to explain why I am a conservative and what it means to me.

In 1964, at the age of 16, I organized the Dallas County Youth for Goldwater. My senior thesis at the University of Texas was on the conservative intellectual revival in America. Twenty years later, I was invited by William F. Buckley Jr. to join the board of National Review. I later became its publisher.

Conservatism to me is less a political philosophy than a stance, a recognition of the fallibility of man and of man's institutions. Conservatives respect the past not for its antiquity but because it represents, as G.K. Chesterton said, the democracy of the dead; it gives the benefit of the doubt to customs and laws tried and tested in the crucible of time. Conservatives are skeptical of abstract theories and utopian schemes, doubtful that government is wiser than its citizens, and always ready to test any political program against actual results.

Liberalism always seemed to me to be a system of "oughts." We ought to do this or that because it's the right thing to do, regardless of whether it works or not. It is a doctrine based on intentions, not results, on feeling good rather than doing good.

But today it is so-called conservatives who are cemented to political programs when they clearly don't work. The Bush tax cutsóa solution for which there was no real problem and which he refused to end even when the nation went to waróled to huge deficit spending and a $3 trillion growth in the federal debt. Facing this, John McCain pumps his "conservative" credentials by proposing even bigger tax cuts. Meanwhile, a movement that once fought for limited government has presided over the greatest growth of government in our history. That is not conservatism; it is profligacy using conservatism as a mask.

Today it is conservatives, not liberals, who talk with alarming bellicosity about making the world "safe for democracy." It is John McCain who says America's job is to "defeat evil," a theological expansion of the nation's mission that would make George Washington cough out his wooden teeth.

This kind of conservatism, which is not conservative at all, has produced financial mismanagement, the waste of human lives, the loss of moral authority and the wreckage of our economy that McCain now threatens to make worse.

Barack Obama is not my ideal candidate for president. (In fact, I made the maximum donation to John McCain during the primaries, when there was still hope he might come to his senses.) But I now see that Obama is almost the ideal candidate for this moment in American history. I disagree with him on many issues. But those don't matter as much as what Obama offers, which is a deeply conservative view of the world. Nobody can read Obama's books (which, it is worth noting, he wrote himself) or listen to him speak without realizing that this is a thoughtful, pragmatic and prudent man. It gives me comfort just to think that after eight years of George W. Bush we will have a president who has actually read the Federalist Papers.

Most important, Obama will be a realist. I doubt he will taunt Russia, as McCain has, at the very moment when our national interest requires it as an ally. The crucial distinction in my mind is that, unlike John McCain, I am convinced he will not impulsively take us into another war unless American national interests are directly threatened.

"Every great cause," Eric Hoffer wrote, "begins as a movement, becomes a business, and eventually degenerates into a racket." As a cause, conservatism may be dead. But as a stance, as a way of making judgments in a complex and difficult world, I believe it is very much alive in the instincts and predispositions of a liberal named Barack Obama.

Allison is chairman and editor-in-chief of D Magazine in Dallas, from which this column is taken. The magazine's Web site is www.dmagazine.com
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Old 09-24-2008, 09:46 PM   #23
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Default Re: McCain wants to suspend Fridays debates

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Originally Posted by tony hipchest View Post
then maybe you should just vote for mccain then (although he hasnt offered up any solutions either).

nobody has them as we are in pretty much unchartered water.

it seems like you are asking a single person (or few) on a single message board to sum up and entire candidates platform. that can be dangerous. with the internet, the sources of info are endless.

ive taken in dozens (if not hundereds of viewpoints) to formulate my opinion. left ,right, and to the middle, on both sides of a specific subject.

i would suggest googling "mccains economic advisors" and "obamas economic advisors" and reading alot of articles both for and agains each candidates advisors. i leaned alot by doing that.

sometimes you will come across an article such as this-
Listen Toney, I like you, and as I said no sarcasm is intended. You are allways the one to make these Obama threads, so I guess I figured you knew something about the guy I didnt. If not then why make these threads? You Seem to be the Obama expert, you constantly make threads in his favor......and thats fine. I don't need media biased articles, so whats your opinion? I'd gladly take the opinion of an average joe over some article that basicly repeats the retoric I've allready heard.
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Old 09-24-2008, 09:48 PM   #24
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Default Re: McCain wants to suspend Fridays debates

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Originally Posted by ohiosteelerfan20 View Post
Maybe they can move the vp debate to friday. I mean Palin is ready right? From day one right?
Yeah and Biden's not the sharpest tool in the shed either.

Quote:
Vice presidential candidate Joe Biden says today's leaders should take a lesson from the history books and follow Democrat Franklin D. Roosevelt's response to a financial crisis.


"When the stock market crashed, Franklin D. Roosevelt got on the television and didn't just talk about the, you know, the princes of greed. He said, 'Look, here's what happened,' " Barack Obama's running mate recently told the CBS Evening News.


The only problem is Republican Herbert Hoover was in office when the stock market crashed in October 1929. There also was no television at the time; TV wasn't introduced to the public until a decade later.
http://trumanstake.blogspot.com/2008...n-america.html

Who needs a history lesson?

Then there are these little gems of wisdom.

http://article.nationalreview.com/?q...YwOGJmYzNjMTY=

Quote:
Biden, on a post-debate appearance on MSNBC, October 30, 2007: “The only guy on the other side who’s qualified is John McCain.”

Biden appearing on The Daily Show, August 2, 2005: “John McCain is a personal friend, a great friend, and I would be honored to run with or against John McCain, because I think the country would be better off, be well off no matter who...”
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Old 09-24-2008, 09:49 PM   #25
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Default Re: McCain wants to suspend Fridays debates

By they way if you read my 1st post I didn't ask you to sum up all his policis as that immposible, only his policy on the economy.
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Old 09-24-2008, 09:53 PM   #26
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Default Re: McCain wants to suspend Fridays debates

steelwall, sorry, after reread of my response it may seem like i totally dismissed your question. i am awaiting the debates and follow up for alot of the specifics.

it is a personal decision for me right now. obama is gonna address more of the issues that directly affect me. at this point and time, i think we need democracy to be the main focus, and not capitalism to the point where it drowns the world market in debt and turmoil. i dont think the rich need the largest tax breaks.

oboma is more likely to carry out the democratic platforms i respect tham mccain is. i do not like the people mccain has surrounded himself with.

i trust in economics that more closely resemble clintons than bush's.

for me, right now, i dont even need all the specifics. its the general idea, that is driving me.

again, what works best for me, may not be best for the majority on this board.

i would be more specific, but i have hundereds of posts and dozens of links on the subject already. just search my profile if you care what i think.

bill richardson in '12!

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Old 09-24-2008, 10:03 PM   #27
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Default Re: McCain wants to suspend Fridays debates

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Originally Posted by MACH1 View Post
Yeah and Biden's not the sharpest tool in the shed either.

]
do a search on the article of bidens gaffes.

there was a hilarious anecdote where he was introducing a representative or senator for the specific state he was speaking in. anyways he said something like "Senator Schmoe, where are you? Please stand up for a round of applause".

the specific senator (or whatever he was) was a parapalegic confined to a wheelchair.
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Old 09-24-2008, 10:18 PM   #28
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Default Re: McCain wants to suspend Fridays debates

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Originally Posted by tony hipchest View Post
steelwall, sorry, after reread of my response it may seem like i totally dismissed your question. i am awaiting the debates and follow up for alot of the specifics.

it is a personal decision for me right now. obama is gonna address more of the issues that directly affect me. at this point and time, i think we need democracy to be the main focus, and not capitalism to the point where it drowns the world market in debt and turmoil. i dont think the rich need the largest tax breaks.

oboma is more likely to carry out the democratic platforms i respect tham mccain is. i do not like the people mccain has surrounded himself with.

i trust in economics that more closely resemble clintons than bush's.

for me, right now, i dont even need all the specifics. its the general idea, that is driving me.

again, what works best for me, may not be best for the majority on this board.

i would be more specific, but i have hundereds of posts and dozens of links on the subject already. just search my profile if you care what i think.

bill richardson in '12!


Thank you Toney, I will research your posts. Given the current econimic condition...honestly I am worried. Perhaps I am partial to Mcain because I myself am a vet.

I guess my fear is that so much will henge of the economy and our enemies will play this to their advantage.

However, without a stable economy ....enemy or not we could be doomed from withen (not a dooms day thinker here, just a realist)

I have problems with Obamas past, the church he attended...and so forth. Had it been Mcain attending a church with the teachings that Obama followed the Republicans woulndt touch him with a 20 foot cattle prod.

Perhaps I am biased, but it is not because of Obamas race. I'm getting off track, but if he is truely the best candiate I would vote for him, however I currently cannot see that he is.

I have followed this election very closely (even though all my information comes from media outlets as I'm in China) but I will vote this election.

Sometimes I feel things are worthless (voteing tha is) we still have the congress, in my opinion most are the scum of the Earth, so how much power does a president actually have.

If Obama wins, and we have a majior crisis, he will take the heat.... more likely because of his race, is that what this country needs? Not basing my vote on race, but you have to admit it is a factor.
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Old 09-24-2008, 11:01 PM   #29
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Default Re: McCain wants to suspend Fridays debates

I think they should postpone or cancel the first debate. Both candidates are sitting Senators and they should be at work right now.

Of course I'm biased...I would love to see Ole Miss get screwed
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Old 09-24-2008, 11:10 PM   #30
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Default Re: McCain wants to suspend Fridays debates

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Originally Posted by steelwall View Post
Thank you Toney, I will research your posts. Given the current econimic condition...honestly I am worried. Perhaps I am partial to Mcain because I myself am a vet.

I guess my fear is that so much will henge of the economy and our enemies will play this to their advantage.

However, without a stable economy ....enemy or not we could be doomed from withen (not a dooms day thinker here, just a realist)

I have problems with Obamas past, the church he attended...and so forth. Had it been Mcain attending a church with the teachings that Obama followed the Republicans woulndt touch him with a 20 foot cattle prod.

.
just for the record, the article i linke above want a biassed media report. it was from a life long conservative and mccain supporter-

Quote:
In 1964, at the age of 16, I organized the Dallas County Youth for Goldwater. My senior thesis at the University of Texas was on the conservative intellectual revival in America. Twenty years later, I was invited by William F. Buckley Jr. to join the board of National Review. I later became its publisher.
by no means am i an obama expert. i didnt even start looking into him or researching until it was evident that my guy (bill richardson) was out of the race.

fwiw- i voted for bush in 04 for nothing more than "staying the course" and showing national soliditarity in a time of war. nothing else. i totally disagreed with the man on just about everything, yet gave him my vote for the appearance of national cohesiveness and to supporth our guys/gals overseas.

im not worried about obamas reverend. ive surrounded myself with people far worse. ive had black and white friends who would be compared as equally racist as the rev. none of their beliefs had any impact on my own.

hell, if you look into some of the people mccain has surrounded himself with, its not to rosey.

his pastor called islam evil and the antichrist. (im Christian and believe if "youre not for me, then you are against me" but i wont go there)

if were trying to squash terrorism from radical islams, a president who ties himself to a religious leader who practically invokes reverse jihad, is probably the last thing that is best for national security.

shoot, mccains own wife was a drug addict who was busted stealing precriptions from her own charity. (i cant hold that against him though).

i am much more scared about mccains ties with his economic mentor phil gramm than i am obamas former religious advisor. after all, gramm is messing with MY money, and retirement, mortgage, economy, etc.

the rev. has no such impact.

obama is a supporter of the americorps program. for me, this is important. i get the feeling that most republican voters feel this is welfare handouts to the poor as opposed to an actual investment in our future, that will save tons of money down the road.

i definitely have opinions on the matter. many have been posted, and many have been dismissed and ignored.

however i do believe the "other side of the coin" has a right to be represented on this board, which is why i post much of what i do. needless to say, it is met with much resistance.

but the balance of the american public is much more evenly split than what those who post on the subject on this board would suggest. ironically enough, dan rooney has even come out as an obama supporter.
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