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Old 12-01-2005, 06:31 PM   #11
XxKnightxX
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Default Re: Cowher

Quote:
Originally Posted by Suitanim
Here's a list of current coaches who have won Super Bowl's:
Bellichick
Gruden
Billick
Vermeil
Shanahan
Holmgren
Gibbs
Parcells

Personally, I think Cowher is a better coach than Gruden, Billick, and Holmgren. That leaves 5 coaches who have won Super Bowls in the NFL. Vermeil is retiring, I think Parcells has lost his magic, the game may have passed Gibbs by, and Shanahan and Bellichick aren't going anywhere. I also think when you talk about how the Rooney's want to approach the game, only Gibbs, Bellichick and Holmgren could ever fit their system, and, again, the Gibbs experiment may be a failure, and Cowher is a better coach than Holmgren (Put Favre on our 95-2004 teams and I bet we win at least 2, if not more, Lombardy trophies)

My favorite question, as always, for Cowher bashers is, who do we replace him with?


It's too easy to blame the coach. When we took almost the exact same team that was 6-10 in 2003 and went 15-1 with it in 2004, who do you think deserves most of the credit for that? The fact of the matter is, Cowher consistently OVERACHIEVES with the talent he has.



Also people need to keep in mind that we need to appreciate that we have a consistent franchise at front office and coaches. Other teams lack the consistency of having a good coaching squad while we had the privilege of being amongst the most steady franchises in history. Where else do you see that a franchise has had only 2 coaches in the past 36 years??
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Old 12-01-2005, 06:43 PM   #12
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Default Re: Cowher

Just to add a couple things, as far as Bellichick, one thing that he did that made him a better coach (and more like a Rooney/Steeler type guy) was he stopped just looking at just empirical data, like guys combine numbers and stats and stuff, and started judging players by film, and effort and drive. That's the difference (Well,at least one of them) between the Browns years and the Pats years.

As far as ST's, Cowher used to focus on it a lot more personally...I guess he probably learned pretty quickly that it's impossible as a HC to spend an inordinate amount of time with just one facet of coaching.

Also, you hear a lot about Cowher not being able to make adjustments...in fact, one of Cowher's strengths always was making adjustments. We almost adjusted our way into a 5th ring in '95 if it wasn't for a couple.......alright, I won't go there again.

Cowher decided after the '03 season that this team was going back to it's roots, to be a run first, pass second team. What people fail to comprehend is that a team like that cannot just evolve at halftime into a pass-happy offense. Running teams live and die by the run, and cannot overcome big deficits. That's where I place blame on Cowher for the Colts game. He took two chances and they cost us the game. If we would have just run the clock out at the end of the 1st half, we'd have had a chance to regroup and come out down 13-7, instead, we passed, it was picked and we gave up an easy 3. Then the onsides kick. Cowher said, and he was right, had we executed properly, that play would have worked. But the players didn't, and I still blame Cowher. By giving them the ball and a MASSIVE amount of momentum that we were trying to steal, we gave them an easy 6 and the game was over at 23-7. Had we maintained that 13-7 deficit, we might have had a chance.

When we achieve balance on offense, have a quality NFL starting QB (Which we are damned close to having), and maintain a top 5 defense, Cowher will win a championship, if not more than one...but we aren't quite there yet.

Wow, that was pretty long-winded, wasn't it?
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Old 12-01-2005, 07:15 PM   #13
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Default Re: Cowher

Cowher is a good coach, but as Bill Simmons on espn.com observed several weeks ago, his teams play at the same level and do not take it up to the next level in the playoffs.

The home field AFC losses have been disappointing, including horrible upsets to 1994 San Diego and 2001 New England. However, I do not recall a Cowher team ever upsetting another team in the playoffs.

Chuck Noll, for all the talent he had, scored several road playoff upsets in his career (1974Oakland, 1984 Denver, 1989 Houston) and, as far as I can recall, never suffered a true playoff upset in his career (1982 San Diego might come close). Winning playoff games you are not supposed to win is one measure of a well coached team to me.

Unfortunately, if a lot goes right one year (1997 and 2004), it often seems the next year reverts to a lower level (1998 and 2005). That having been said, I cannot see anyone on the market who is better than Cowher.
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Old 12-01-2005, 07:29 PM   #14
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Default Re: Cowher

shanahan and holmgren havent won a playoff game without farve or elway. in that time cowher has won them with a rookie qb, maddox, and kordell. if cowher had a farve-hof, elway-hof or marino-hof in his career, people would talk about him as a sure fire hall of famer, with at least 3 super bowl wins.

cowher has adjusted well to losing more coaches who go onto head coaching jobs than any other head coach out there today. sure b. walsh had alot too but he also had j. montana-hof. cowher also lost plenty of defensive free agents not to mention the only qb to get him to the sb and all the good wr from that year and still managed to put out #1 defenses and top of the league running games. while he probably woulda rather had urlacher, he drafted p. burress. t. edwards was a high 1st rounder. he knows when to address the teams needs. we finally drafted a qb in the 1st round when everyone said we needed a cb or rb. cowher works well with mgmt. and ownership to make all these things happen.

cowher has become the face of the steelers. the rooneys arent stupid. cowher, his consistency, his professionallism and capabilities and potential to win it all are good for business. keeps fans interested, sells jerseys, keeps you on mnf 3 nights a year. hell i live in new mexico and theres been only 4 steeler games not on local stations. the rooneys kept noll around till '89, 10 years after going to a sb. and then he wasnt even fired he retired. i wouldnt trade cowher for a billick, shannahan, or gruden (although gruden does seem like he would be a perfect steeler).
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Old 12-01-2005, 07:42 PM   #15
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Default Re: Cowher

And, again, I contend that the one common denominator of ALL Cowher teams, and the thing that excuses him from being tarred and feathered is QB. O'Donnell was the closest thing we ever had to a competent QB, and he had the bad fortune of throwing all his INT's in the Super Bowl. I'd still say Neil was a better QB than either Trent Dilfer or Doug Williams, but one game makes all the difference, I guess.

I'll say something now that's going to be close to blasphemy, but it's true. If Chuck Noll had to use the crap QB's that Cowher has had, he'd have 1 Super Bowl title, not 4.

Now we have Ben, and he has all the tools. No excuses. We need to win Super Bowls in the immediate future...
(EDIT)

Looks like me and Tony were on the same wavelength here...
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Old 12-01-2005, 07:44 PM   #16
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Default Re: Cowher

I personally have just about had it with Cowher.
13 seasons and getting ready to finish the 14th and what has he got to show for it?.....Eight division titles which is a nice accomplishment but that easily gets drowned out by the 4 AFCC Game losses and the one loss in his lone Super Bowl appearance.

Cowher supporters that argue:(and I used to be one of them that felt this way) "Hey look at all of the success that he's brought the franchise over the years regardless of his record in the playoffs.....and that he's keeping the Steelers competitive........and the classic who else could be brought in to be the head coach?? I think are stuck for being satisfied with the "Close but no cigar mentality".

I really didn't start to get down on Cowher until the '01 AFCC game against the Pats and it's been going downhill ever since. He had the perfect set-up to redeem himself last year and finally deliver another Super Bowl appearance to the Steeler faithful but all we got was another slap in the face with another poorly played game.
A championship game loss hurts almost as bad as a 6-10 season.

This year Cowher has been way too predictable and pigheaded and these same traits have the Steelers teetering on the edge of the cliff. If the Steelers miss the playoffs this season I hope Dan Rooney finally wakes up and smells the coffee and holds Cowher to some degree of accountability and ponders the thought of hiring another headcoach.
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Old 12-01-2005, 07:51 PM   #17
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Default Re: Cowher

Nice posts Suit ,and I couldn't agree more. There is no one out there that could replace him. Now lets put this topic to bed until the season is over, hopefully on 02 /05/06.
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Old 12-01-2005, 07:57 PM   #18
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Default Re: Cowher

Well, Ambridge is upset, and he has every right to be...to be honest, this topic won't, and can't ever be put to rest until Cowher wins a Super Bowl.

I staked my claim. He has a QB who can play in the NFL now. Give him 2 more years and we'll see.

John, '01 pissed me off, too, but Kordell was what he had to work with...winging INT's into the endzone is okay if you are a rookie, but Kordell wasn't. Give Ben a year or two.
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Old 12-01-2005, 07:57 PM   #19
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Default Re: Cowher

Quote:
Originally Posted by Suitanim
I'll say something now that's going to be close to blasphemy, but it's true. If Chuck Noll had to use the crap QB's that Cowher has had, he'd have 1 Super Bowl title, not 4.

(EDIT)

Looks like me and Tony were on the same wavelength here...
for sure. hell the greatest team of all time (76 steelers) missed the sb when terry bradshaw and franco harris were knocked out of the playoffs. terry was the true essense of quarterback and wouldve laughed if asked to run a dink and dunk or west coast offense. (i think he still holds the national record, in track and field, for javelin throw for high schoolers, a know he broke it back then, if he doesnt still hold it.)

people never mention the 3 afc champ games c. noll lost to d. schula, and j. madden. noll lost too. every coach is that much better with a hof qb
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Old 12-01-2005, 08:03 PM   #20
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Default Re: Cowher

Cowher is no doubt one of the most successful coaches in NFL history, and we've had the talent to get to the big dance on more than 1 occasion during our playoff runs..so it comes back to coaches and gameplanning. yes there were times when players didnt execute there is no doubt.. turnovers, missed opportunities..but when it comes down it, Cowher will be looked down upon by his peers if he doesnt win atleast 1 SB ring and very soon.

He is stubborn and sticks to his guns when it comes to his type of football...but the problem is alot of other coaches play their type of football too but they gameplan against their opponent to exploit them...not just play our game and hope we come out on top.

The works in the regular season and usually early in the playoffs, but not when ur deep into the playoffs.

Our defense generally always shows up, regular season, post season, they play tough and give our offense a chance..

but our offense never does anythign in the postseason, and THAT comes back on the coach.
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