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September 7, 2014, 1:00pmET

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Old 10-13-2008, 07:30 PM   #21
RoethlisBURGHer
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Default Re: Harrison, Roethlisberger shining team lights

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Originally Posted by SunshineMan21 View Post
I like Big Ben as much as the next guy, but at the moment people can make arguments for him, P. Manning, and Brees all at the top of the heap. I would rank the top QBs with Brady out like this (even if they haven't neccessarily been dominant thus far this year):

1. Peyton Manning
2. Big Ben
3. Drew Brees
4. Brett Favre
5. Jay Cutler
6. Tony Romo
7. Donovan McNabb
8. Eli Manning
9. Phillip Rivers
10. Matt Hasselbeck

Honorable Mention to Jason Campbell, Carson Palmer, Kurt Warner.

Another person who cannot read.

This article had to do with TEAM AWARDS.

As in Steelers MVP, Steelers Comeback Player.

And once again, last year Ben outplayed Peyton Manning. And until yesterday, he hd looked like complete crap so far this season.
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Old 10-14-2008, 03:52 AM   #22
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Default Re: Harrison, Roethlisberger shining team lights

everything but the draft.... give them a chance. you can't expect everyone to reach greatness in there first season like BIG BEN. most of these guys were drafted to add to the dept chart. uou have to give a little time.
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Old 10-14-2008, 10:23 AM   #23
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Default Re: Harrison, Roethlisberger shining team lights

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Originally Posted by Preacher View Post
Oh, I don't know... Show respect for a HUMAN BEING and don't cheer injuries.

Oh, I forgot, we ARE talking about the Browns fans. They don't have anything else to cheer about.


Son, I suggest you just put your tail between your legs and walk away.

O
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Old 10-16-2008, 10:03 PM   #24
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Default Re: Harrison, Roethlisberger shining team lights

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Originally Posted by RoethlisBURGHer View Post
Another person who cannot read.

This article had to do with TEAM AWARDS.

As in Steelers MVP, Steelers Comeback Player.

And once again, last year Ben outplayed Peyton Manning. And until yesterday, he hd looked like complete crap so far this season.
There's really no need for the rancor--I read perfectly well.

If you'd like to revisit the original post, it was stated that with Tom Brady out, Big Ben is "quite simply" the best quarterback in the NFL.

I agree that he's our team offensive MVP, but I disagree that he's clearly the best QB in the NFL. Not taking anything away from Ben, but Manning and Brees have done enough not to be dismissed with such ease as people seem keen to do.
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Old 10-16-2008, 10:15 PM   #25
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Default Re: Harrison, Roethlisberger shining team lights

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Originally Posted by RoethlisBURGHer View Post
Seriously, he outplayed Peyton Manning last season, and up until yesterday Manning looked like complete crap.

Not to mention this was an article dealing strictly with the Steelers and their TEAM AWARDS...but I wouldn't expect YOU to realize that.
Uh no, he did not outplay Manning last year.

Manning 2007 DVOA: 36% (2nd best)
Big Ben 2007 DVOA: 15.5% (13th best)

Sacks count against a QB, which certainly accounts for the size of the discrepancy. If they didn't count, I'd imagine Ben would've been top 10 for sure, maybe higher, but still worse than Manning.

So far this year, Manning ranks 11th while Ben ranks 21st.

Again sacks are killing Ben's numbers, but he is partially to blame for them, and even if they didn't count against him, Manning has been better.
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Old 10-16-2008, 10:18 PM   #26
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Default Re: Harrison, Roethlisberger shining team lights

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Uh no, he did not outplay Manning last year.

Manning 2007 DVOA: 36% (2nd best)
Big Ben 2007 DVOA: 15.5% (13th best)

Sacks count against a QB, which certainly accounts for the size of the discrepancy. If they didn't count, I'd imagine Ben would've been top 10 for sure, maybe higher, but still worse than Manning.
So throwing MORE TD passes and FEWER INTS means nothing, I suppose.
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Old 10-16-2008, 10:29 PM   #27
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Default Re: Harrison, Roethlisberger shining team lights

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So throwing MORE TD passes and FEWER INTS means nothing, I suppose.
TD/INT ratio is a decent stat, but it doesn't tell the whole story. Who had more "gimme" TD passes (i.e play action inside the 5 yd line)? Who threw more INT's per attempt? How strong were the opponents?

I'll admit I was a bit surprised to see Ben that much lower than Manning considering he threw 1 more TD and 2 less INT, but when you take into account the sacks, INT's per attempt, and strength of schedule (we had a fairly cake schedule last year, especially compared to the Colts), it becomes a bit more clear.

I do think Ben is closer to Manning than the numbers indicate, since he has a much worse offensive line, a worse running game, and inferior WR's (though Ward/Holmes/Washington/Miller is almost as good as Wayne/Harrison/Gonzo/Clark)

If you go back to our SB year when he had a better O-line and running game to support him, Ben ranked 2nd while Manning was 1st.

Likewise in his rookie year Ben was 5th while Manning was 1st.
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Old 10-16-2008, 11:11 PM   #28
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Default Re: Harrison, Roethlisberger shining team lights

Good reading, and I've also wondered why Miller hasn't had too many calls thrown in his direction. The Steelers should take advantage of his talent.
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Old 10-18-2008, 09:21 PM   #29
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Default Re: Harrison, Roethlisberger shining team lights

Good read. You definitely did some home work and thought deep about what you wrote.
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Old 10-19-2008, 06:57 AM   #30
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Default Re: Harrison, Roethlisberger shining team lights

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So throwing MORE TD passes and FEWER INTS means nothing, I suppose.
.....all while running for his life or 3/4 of the way sacked.
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