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Old 01-08-2010, 02:30 AM   #1
lionslicer
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The Steelers have missed one year of the playoffs, then made the playoffs to consectutive years, then missed the playoffs, and so on.
Same goes for the defense. Defense was dominant in the years we made the playoffs, so was the running game. In years are offense was more explosive with more passing yards, are also the years the team didn't make the playoffs.

Seems to be a pattern, during years where the Steelers ran the ball, milked the clock, our defense has been better and we made the playoffs.
Only Exception to this is 2002, but we used a short passing game using Ward, and ran out the clock that way.

The reason our defense is better during better running years is because our defense, the 3-4 blitzburgh defense, whether is LeBeau or someone else calling the plays, is only good when its playing for something, in the begining of games, and then with the lead lets the offense milk the clock and play to a team trying to score quickly, and dropping back the d-backs and defending the pass.

This year we had an explosive offense, but in the 2nd half because we could not run or even use short passes to run out the clock, the defense was out on the field against teams using short quick passes going down the field and scoring. Now our offensive line isn't the best line for running, it doesn't help Arians doesn't believe in Fullbacks or short 4-5 yard passes to run out the clock. Instead he calls dumb runing plays, and doesn't consistantly run the ball so the defense expects the pass and stops it.

Also on years we had top coverage units on special teams are years we went to the superbowl.

PS: The colts defense is better because in games were manning strugles and puts less than 20 points on the board and the defense is out there defending that lead, they make sure they win unlike our defense. We only ranked 5th in defense because we had the best first half defense, we allowed so few yards inthe first half that in the 2nd half when we allowed so much scoring and yards, it really didn't effect the overall yardage in the defensive stats.

Last edited by lionslicer; 01-08-2010 at 03:41 AM.
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Old 01-08-2010, 03:11 AM   #2
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Default Re: Since 2000

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Originally Posted by lionslicer View Post
The Steelers have missed one year of the playoffs, then made the playoffs to consectutive years, then missed the playoffs, and so on.
Same goes for the defense. Defense was dominant in the years we made the playoffs, so was the running game. In years are offense was more explosive with more passing yards, are also the years the team didn't make the playoffs.

Seems to be a pattern, during years where the Steelers ran the ball, milked the clock, our defense has been better and we made the playoffs.
Only Exception to this is 2002, but we used a short passing game using Ward, and ran out the clock that way.

The reason our defense is better during better running years is because our defense, the 3-4 blitzburgh defense, whether is LeBeau or someone else calling the plays, is only good when its playing for something, in the begining of games, and then with the lead lets the offense milk the clock and play to a team trying to score quickly, and dropping back the d-backs and defending the pass.

This year we had an explosive offense, but in the 2nd half because we could not run or even use short passes to run out the clock, the defense was out on the field against teams using short quick passes going down the field and scoring. Now our offensive line isn't the best line for running, it doesn't help Arians doesn't believe in Fullbacks or short 4-5 yard passes to run out the clock. Instead he calls dumb runing plays, and doesn't consistantly run the ball so the defense expects the pass and stops it.

Also on years we had top coverage units on special teams are years we went to the superbowl.
At some point you guys have to stop trying to find every excuse in the book for the defense and just admit they were subpar. If the players can do it, the staff can do it, the writers do it, so can you.

Of course I guess you know more than everyone else, so I grovel before you.
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Old 01-08-2010, 03:29 AM   #3
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At some point you guys have to stop trying to find every excuse in the book for the defense and just admit they were subpar. If the players can do it, the staff can do it, the writers do it, so can you.

Of course I guess you know more than everyone else, so I grovel before you.
I don't know more than everyone else :P
I think I know more X's and O's than the average football fan, tis all... but generically I'm a stupid person and probably don't deserve to share my opinions with people. I don't even think Arians should be fired, he knows a lot about offensive schemes and the passing game. I think this was the Steelers worst defensive season since 1991. I am ashamed to even defend their defense, but looking at the past and present, the defense sucks when there is no running game with the lead, its a fact. So it made me pretty much assume the defensive scheme itself is not full proof like everyone things.

I am not finding excuses why the defense sucks, I'm saying its only good when the offense knows how to utilize it. I just ripped on the defense because it can't win games if its out there constantly. Other defenses like the colts defense can win games for Peyton when he only puts less than 20 points on the board because they are a much better defense. Our defense is good in short bursts of awesome, but when its out there for a while, you can tell their are a lot of holes and flaws with it.

Don't ever compare me to some of these Lebeau lovers. I'm not one of these people who are constantly on LeBeau's dick, I love what he's done for the team, but i'm not going to change my core beliefs of football because I'm a Steelers fan.

Last edited by lionslicer; 01-08-2010 at 03:39 AM.
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Old 01-08-2010, 06:24 AM   #4
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Default Re: Since 2000

Quote:
Originally Posted by lionslicer View Post
The Steelers have missed one year of the playoffs, then made the playoffs to consectutive years, then missed the playoffs, and so on.
Same goes for the defense. Defense was dominant in the years we made the playoffs, so was the running game. In years are offense was more explosive with more passing yards, are also the years the team didn't make the playoffs.

Seems to be a pattern, during years where the Steelers ran the ball, milked the clock, our defense has been better and we made the playoffs.
Only Exception to this is 2002, but we used a short passing game using Ward, and ran out the clock that way.

The reason our defense is better during better running years is because our defense, the 3-4 blitzburgh defense, whether is LeBeau or someone else calling the plays, is only good when its playing for something, in the begining of games, and then with the lead lets the offense milk the clock and play to a team trying to score quickly, and dropping back the d-backs and defending the pass.

This year we had an explosive offense, but in the 2nd half because we could not run or even use short passes to run out the clock, the defense was out on the field against teams using short quick passes going down the field and scoring. Now our offensive line isn't the best line for running, it doesn't help Arians doesn't believe in Fullbacks or short 4-5 yard passes to run out the clock. Instead he calls dumb runing plays, and doesn't consistantly run the ball so the defense expects the pass and stops it.

Also on years we had top coverage units on special teams are years we went to the superbowl.

PS: The colts defense is better because in games were manning strugles and puts less than 20 points on the board and the defense is out there defending that lead, they make sure they win unlike our defense. We only ranked 5th in defense because we had the best first half defense, we allowed so few yards inthe first half that in the 2nd half when we allowed so much scoring and yards, it really didn't effect the overall yardage in the defensive stats.
Generally stats are meaningless. As proved with the O this season, lots of yards but the points didn't match. That all being said, I believe our Offense held the ball longer than our opponents through the season, with the exception of a couple of games. There were times in the second half of games where , it looked to me, we were trying to run the clock out running the ball. That caused the ire of many of the fans in the stadium and on here. Run, Run, Pass didnt work. Why you may ask, because this team isn't built that way anymore. In the second half , when we had leads the opposition still expected us to run, and took it away. WE ARE A PASS FIRST TEAM NOW , we can use this to set up a quality running game as well. The Miami game showed that.
Although the Offense didn't capitalize on it's opportunities in the red zone this season, that hurt.
OUr defense struggled IMO due to the following factors.

1. injuries to Troy and Aaron, the chemistry in the secondary was shaken up with Troy out and the DL W/O Smith was unable to sustain pressure and was not very effective against the run (see 2007)

2. We struggled in coverage. part of that has to do with Troy being out, part of that obviously is that the talents of some of the players (Gay, Carter) was misjudged.

3. Tackling was horrible, that goes back to training camp

4. Age of some key players. Farrior, Deshea, and key players on the DL have gotten long in the tooth, and consequently have lost a step.

5. Lack of pressure from our DL. See above on Age and no Smith.

This I am sure will be corrected with a healthy D, some infusion of young talent ( Hood IMO will have a breakout season next year, as Woodley did in his 2nd year)

The offense will be fine , It's evolving, the only thing that should go is the constant use of empty backfield in the red zone.

YOu have valid opinions but don't get arrogant because you think you know X's and O's better than most. Lot's of people on here are intelligent about the game, have good opinions and probably have either played or coached at some point in their lives.
Saying when we run more we are in the playoffs when we pass we are not is an oversimplification of the problems this team had this season (you failed to mention anything about ST)
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Old 01-08-2010, 07:09 AM   #5
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Generally stats are meaningless. As proved with the O this season, lots of yards but the points didn't match. That all being said, I believe our Offense held the ball longer than our opponents through the season, with the exception of a couple of games. There were times in the second half of games where , it looked to me, we were trying to run the clock out running the ball. That caused the ire of many of the fans in the stadium and on here. Run, Run, Pass didnt work. Why you may ask, because this team isn't built that way anymore. In the second half , when we had leads the opposition still expected us to run, and took it away. WE ARE A PASS FIRST TEAM NOW , we can use this to set up a quality running game as well. The Miami game showed that.
Although the Offense didn't capitalize on it's opportunities in the red zone this season, that hurt.
OUr defense struggled IMO due to the following factors.

1. injuries to Troy and Aaron, the chemistry in the secondary was shaken up with Troy out and the DL W/O Smith was unable to sustain pressure and was not very effective against the run (see 2007)

2. We struggled in coverage. part of that has to do with Troy being out, part of that obviously is that the talents of some of the players (Gay, Carter) was misjudged.

3. Tackling was horrible, that goes back to training camp

4. Age of some key players. Farrior, Deshea, and key players on the DL have gotten long in the tooth, and consequently have lost a step.

5. Lack of pressure from our DL. See above on Age and no Smith.

This I am sure will be corrected with a healthy D, some infusion of young talent ( Hood IMO will have a breakout season next year, as Woodley did in his 2nd year)

The offense will be fine , It's evolving, the only thing that should go is the constant use of empty backfield in the red zone.

YOu have valid opinions but don't get arrogant because you think you know X's and O's better than most. Lot's of people on here are intelligent about the game, have good opinions and probably have either played or coached at some point in their lives.
Saying when we run more we are in the playoffs when we pass we are not is an oversimplification of the problems this team had this season (you failed to mention anything about ST)
You get my arrogance mixed up with just me being angry. Someone on myspace pissed me off about the whole thing, and he's been getting under my skin since the season started. He's also a racist and constantly rips on Tomlin and every black player on the team. I kind of took it out on everyone and it was 4 am and yeah.

You're right, a lot has to do with key players missing and age. But I'm tired of people defending LeBeau. Good coaches make up for their losses and coach no name players into the system. Bill Bellicheck might be cheating on offense, but in general, he makes up for losses on his team, and especially defense and they come out every year with no name players and usually have one of the best defenses every year. I don't like the Patriots, but coaching wise, they are better. And if our coaches could actually coach, we wouldn't have to rely on 2 players to win our games on defense.

I'm just driven to blow up every time someone defends the defense, it has never been that great, our offense has always made up for it. People don't relize in years we went to the playoffs, we were also #1 or #2 in the league in time of possession(except 2008), not leaving much time for the defense to be out there showing their weaknesses. I'm not saying our defense sucks, I'm not saying it was bad just because of coaching. Obviously Troy and Aaron Smith are amazing players and cause disruption, but the face of your defense can't be 2 players. Real championship teams lose players every year, and still somehow win games. Colts went without their starting 2 defensive ends, who are regarded as the best pass rushers in the NFL for a couple games, and did their defense burn to the ground? no.
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Old 01-08-2010, 10:00 AM   #6
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You get my arrogance mixed up with just me being angry. Someone on myspace pissed me off about the whole thing, and he's been getting under my skin since the season started. He's also a racist and constantly rips on Tomlin and every black player on the team. I kind of took it out on everyone and it was 4 am and yeah.

You're right, a lot has to do with key players missing and age. But I'm tired of people defending LeBeau. Good coaches make up for their losses and coach no name players into the system. Bill Bellicheck might be cheating on offense, but in general, he makes up for losses on his team, and especially defense and they come out every year with no name players and usually have one of the best defenses every year. I don't like the Patriots, but coaching wise, they are better. And if our coaches could actually coach, we wouldn't have to rely on 2 players to win our games on defense.

I'm just driven to blow up every time someone defends the defense, it has never been that great, our offense has always made up for it. People don't relize in years we went to the playoffs, we were also #1 or #2 in the league in time of possession(except 2008), not leaving much time for the defense to be out there showing their weaknesses. I'm not saying our defense sucks, I'm not saying it was bad just because of coaching. Obviously Troy and Aaron Smith are amazing players and cause disruption, but the face of your defense can't be 2 players. Real championship teams lose players every year, and still somehow win games. Colts went without their starting 2 defensive ends, who are regarded as the best pass rushers in the NFL for a couple games, and did their defense burn to the ground? no.
I appreciate your passion, however sometimes, no matter good a coach, you can't coach up sub par players. The Lebeau system is very complicated, that is usually why rookies can't come in and start right away, not even Troy. Comparing The Colts DE in a 4-3 to Smith in the 3-4 is like comparing apples and oranges. A 3-4 end asked to do more, losing a great player hurts. I read some comments by R.Clark about the Chemistry he and Troy had, knowing what each other will do without speaking. That kind of instinct takes time to develop, and "coaching a player up" no matter how good a coach is can't take the place of that. This defense is complicated, Lebeau doesn't get a total pass, I am sure he could have done things differently. But as the Arians supporters say, sometimes a player has to make plays, I have said this all along, we dropped way too many pics this year and that cost us 3 games for sure, probably more. Make those plays and we are getting ready to defend our Super bowl, our defense struggled and some of that is worn by coaching, but again make if the players make plays when they are presented to them we are talking about a good defense, not blaming them for missed playoffs.

BTW, you have also stated that if we held the ball longer it our D is off the field, well again as I say stats don't say the whole picture.
our T.O.P was 32:52 per game.... 3rd in the NFL, 13 seconds per game off being #1.
This season was a total team failure
Poor secondary play
Poor red zone efficiency and the worst special teams play I have ever seen from the Steelers.
Not one cost us this season, but a combination of all 3.
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Old 01-08-2010, 10:27 AM   #7
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BTW, you have also stated that if we held the ball longer it our D is off the field, well again as I say stats don't say the whole picture.
our T.O.P was 32:52 per game.... 3rd in the NFL, 13 seconds per game off being #1.
This season was a total team failure
Poor secondary play
Poor red zone efficiency and the worst special teams play I have ever seen from the Steelers.
Not one cost us this season, but a combination of all 3.
Again, we held the ball like 20 minutes in the first half, and bearly had it in the 2nd half. And when was our defense terrible? 2nd half, bam. Never said that was the main reason, just something that over the years made a big difference in our defenses play.
2004 steelers time of possession per game was 35-40 minuts with a solid running attack. Our Defense was number one that year was number 1

And the secondary did play bad, but steelers rarely play man to man defense, recievers are wide open in certain parts of the field against the zone which is why teams destroy us with short passing attacks. In our defense, d-backs are taught to make contact at the line and let a linebacker or saftey cover them deep, or cover very deep and let a linebacker cover them if they take a shorter route. For a quarterback, with so many players running around, to see these huge openings is hard, but its the NFL, these guys are so professional, they get into a rhythm and can throw the ball to a reciever without even looking. This becomes a problem late in games when our offense is having 3 and outs and handing the ball back to the other team. If this was the same defense from last year, when LeBeau was calling more blitzes, that wouldn't be a problem, but apparently since everyone is one year older they have slowed down and can't play the game anymore LeBeau doesn't think they can make plays and calls more conservative defense. Because thats what everyone seems to make it seem, that age is a number one factor because everyone aged one year.

I do agree that this whole year was a failure, every aspect of the team did something to lose all those games. Even if the offense was had a good year, but teams don't win without a constant running game.
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