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Old 03-27-2010, 12:22 PM   #41
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Default Re: Let me see if I got this right

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Does being conservative mean you hate people simply because they seek a better life? I guess so
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Old 03-27-2010, 02:32 PM   #42
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What kills me even more about the illegals is that our legal system at times tends to think that these illegals have more rights under our constituion than those of us who are legal citizens of the country.

Either way the illegals are a drain on our system, from the criminals to the "take care of us now" migrant workers.

If anyone in DC gave a rats arse about their constituents, then they would have truly overhauled healthcare for those who need it, they would have listened to those that vote (not the ones that will be able to vote if the immigration reform gets pushed through), and they would as eagerly do something about the illegals in the country that doesn't involved giving them amnesty and instant citizenship or access to our social systems enabling them to ride through life with little to no responsibility.
Firstly, prioritizing criminality among migrant workers above corporate crimes is simply absurd. It's like blaming low air in your tires for the smoke coming out of your tailpipe.

Secondly, getting everyone covered benefits everyone, particularly when we're talking about the people picking the fruits and vegetables that you and your kids are eating.

Thirdly, neither the Democrats nor the Republicans have any interest in universal coverage; that was a popular desire, and the two parties have no interest in populism. So, you needn't worry about undocumented workers somehow now having better benefits than you and I. Didn't happen, and it ain't gonna happen.
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Old 03-27-2010, 02:36 PM   #43
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Default Re: Let me see if I got this right

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Does being liberal mean you hate large companies like AT & T, Microsoft, Fed Ex, and Chase (whom provide thousands of jobs to working families), simply because they seek profits? I guess so
Being anti-corporate has nothing to do with my opinion on business. I submit that it is absolutely impossible to be both pro-business and pro-corporate. I'll refer you to Adam Smith for an explanation on that topic.

smokin: this reply is for you as well.
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Old 03-27-2010, 10:01 PM   #44
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[/B]

C'mon man.. really? Rich people get a free ride? How do you think they got rich?! Do you think they were assigned to be CEO of a world wide corporation at birth? Do you have ANY idea how much work/stress is involved to climb the latter like that?
paris hilton and her work/stress is a perfect example of this. i guess it is important to differentiate "new money" vs "old money" and who is self made vs. all those who are born with a silver spoon.

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BTW Who do you think creates more jobs, evil rich people or poor people
who do you think does all the labor? kind hearted rich people who flip billions of burgers for mcdonalds? or the evil scum, poor people.

i wonder where sam walton of wal-mart would be w/o all the poor people he employed.

i wonder how nike would be doing w/o all the sweatshop slave labor of the poor it employs.

yes the rich people create the jobs. but the labor creates the product. kind of a symbiotic relationship, wouldnt you say?
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Old 03-28-2010, 08:51 AM   #45
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yes the rich people create the jobs. but the labor creates the product. kind of a symbiotic relationship, wouldnt you say?
I would most definitely agree. I'm one of the "laborers" that produces the product for the rich owner of the company I work for. There is no way he would have a product to sell, if not for me and others like me... skilled tradesmen. We are not easily replaced, but you'd never know it by the way we are treated and paid.

I see I've taken this thread in the wrong direction... sorry. Your post struck a nerve and I just pounced...LOL.
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Old 03-28-2010, 02:32 PM   #46
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paris hilton and her work/stress is a perfect example of this. i guess it is important to differentiate "new money" vs "old money" and who is self made vs. all those who are born with a silver spoon.
I agree. paris hilton is a joke of a person and human being and if the Gov. wanted to tax her into poverty my heart wouldn't bleed as she has never put her blood, sweat, or tears into anything
Yes, self made and silver spoon are two completely different things but it seems that they often get lumped together as rich evil doers. Make money during the day, then at night they put on a mask and eat babies at night.

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who do you think does all the labor? kind hearted rich people who flip billions of burgers for mcdonalds? or the evil scum, poor people. The people who WORK. Not the ones sitting at home, collecting checks, not looking for a job and getting everything they are 'entitled' to.

i wonder where sam walton of wal-mart would be w/o all the poor people he employed.Many, many cars and houses have been bought because of paychecks earned through walmart. If walmart were to close up shop tomorrow, would that hurt or help the people involved or the economy?

i wonder how nike would be doing w/o all the sweatshop slave labor of the poor it employs.

yes the rich people create the jobs. but the labor creates the product. kind of a symbiotic relationship, wouldnt you say?
I would say but I don't see what this argument has to do with anything since the laborers are not the ones being crucified and taxed to death right now. It's not as if they do the work for a sense of feeling good about themselves. They do it to get paid, and to hopefully move up in the company. They provide a service, and they get compensated for it. If they feel they aren't compensated enough, then they have the freedom to work for the competition. Obviously it goes hand in hand and one couldn't do it without the other.

My point is for a business to expand, grow, and add jobs it takes a person or business with money. When we started out business we had 1 concrete truck. It took a lot of time, money, stress, effort and dare I say balls to expand to 12 trucks. Once we did, we were able to provide jobs to 11 other drivers, a loader man, full time mechanic, dispatcher, yard guy, book keeper, and office manager. If we are taxed to death and have no money to expand, that's 18 unemployment checks our government would have to send out and perhaps a few more mortgages/cars being defaulted on.

Businesses HAVE to make money. If they don't make money and hit a bad month, bad year, or a lawsuit... POOF! It's all gone.

Abe Lincoln said it best "You can't make a weak man strong by making a strong man weak"

The argument isn't Business/Employer vs Employee/laborer. It's People who work for what they have (those well of and laborers alike) vs the people who don't.

Everyone one of us here works hard for what we have. Don't you think everyone else should to?


Anyways, Sorry Venom. We got WAAAYYYY off topic here.

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Old 03-28-2010, 02:34 PM   #47
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I would most definitely agree. I'm one of the "laborers" that produces the product for the rich owner of the company I work for. There is no way he would have a product to sell, if not for me and others like me... skilled tradesmen. We are not easily replaced, but you'd never know it by the way we are treated and paid.

I see I've taken this thread in the wrong direction... sorry. Your post struck a nerve and I just pounced...LOL.
If you are treated and paid poorly then A) Work for his competition or B) Start your own business doing what your doing anyways. Then YOU reap the rewards but you have to be willing to accept the risk and consequences of venturing out on your own for something better. (90% of new business go belly up in the first year and the rest don't see a profit for five years)

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Old 03-28-2010, 02:52 PM   #48
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I would say but I don't see what this argument has to do with anything since the laborers are not the ones being crucified and taxed to death right now.

.
im sorry you feel that way but i understand.

from a personal point of view, i have never witnessed a crucifixion in the United States. I have also never heard or rich people being killed by taxes (although i have heard of those that kill themselves when busted for fraud or no longer able to maintain their lofty lifestyles). the only ones i really have heard refer to capitalist america as the evil devil are the exremist islamics.

however i have witnessed, poor, homeless, disabled veterans rotting away 9and sometimes dead) on the streets.

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It's not as if they do the work for a sense of feeling good about themselves. They do it to get paid, and to hopefully move up in the company
i have about 30 employees who are disabled and could easilly live off welfare or social security who would beg to differ with you.

i interviewed a disable veteran for an administrative assistant position just last week who is going stir crazy being a housewife, wants to put her skills to use, and re-gain that sense of contribution and self worth.

money and climbing the corporate ladder are not an issue or priority with her.
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Old 03-28-2010, 03:32 PM   #49
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im sorry you feel that way but i understand.

from a personal point of view, i have never witnessed a crucifixion in the United States. I have also never heard or rich people being killed by taxes (although i have heard of those that kill themselves when busted for fraud or no longer able to maintain their lofty lifestyles). the only ones i really have heard refer to capitalist america as the evil devil are the exremist islamics.

however i have witnessed, poor, homeless, disabled veterans rotting away 9and sometimes dead) on the streets.



i have about 30 employees who are disabled and could easilly live off welfare or social security who would beg to differ with you.

i interviewed a disable veteran for an administrative assistant position just last week who is going stir crazy being a housewife, wants to put her skills to use, and re-gain that sense of contribution and self worth.

money and climbing the corporate ladder are not an issue or priority with her.
Tony, I applaud those people. THAT is what America is about! Unfortunately they are the exception, and not the majority.

As far as never witnessing a crucifixion in the US.. You're right. No one is being burned alive in the streets. It all happens behind the scenes. Something that most people don't see or have any idea about. Money gets pissed away through the government (both administrations alike) and when they need more they come straight for the working class because everyone knows you can't get blood from a stone.

A quick example.. besides paying a huge amount of road taxes & even more taxes through diesel fuel, registration for each truck ran about $800/truck each year. That's about $9,600/year. Kinda sucks but palatable. Now Florida needs more revenue because it all got pissed away, registration jumped to almost $2,000 PER truck.. That's almost $24,000 we have to pay in CASH just to register the trucks and put them on the road each year. The money has to come from somewhere, and we don't have that kind of money so we only registered 5 trucks for 10k. The other trucks we parked and had to lay off those drivers for now. Only God knows what will happen when we have to pay for emissions and other taxes/expenses that will occur when cap and trade and/or healthcare take effect. That is us getting killed by taxes. All I am saying is that the money has to come from somewhere and when it does, EVERYONE is affected.

Again, hats off to those you mentioned who refuse to let circumstance dictate their lives!!
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Old 03-28-2010, 03:36 PM   #50
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If you are treated and paid poorly then A) Work for his competition or B) Start your own business doing what your doing anyways. Then YOU reap the rewards.
What a great idea! Everyone should start their own business! It's so easy, I dont know why more people dont do it!

PS how's the weather on Fantasy Island?
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