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Old 12-01-2011, 12:57 PM   #91
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Default Re: Hate that Ravens fans have for the Steelers!!!

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First off, I never defended Bens character. Never said he was a good guy, or even a half decent one. You're rationale for why you think he is guilty is quite a weak one, at best. You asked if every person who is indicted is guilty...but you are unable to turn that same question around regarding Bens case. Is every man who is accused automatically guilty? Seems so in your mind.

With that said, it's quite hilarious that you are on here defending Lewis (which I understand) and asking if I think everyone who is indicted is guilty. I obviously don't think that. I'm just using your own argument against you...and it's working. It's amusing that in one sentence you defend Lewis, basically because as Americans we all have the right to be innocent until proven guilty...and then in the next sentence vilify and place your own opinion of guilt on Ben even though there wasn't even enough evidence for a trial. Hypocrite much?

On a side note, can you give me this weeks lottery numbers? You seem to have all kinds of insider information and or have incredible psychic powers regarding Bens accusation and lack of trial. I figure if you have the clairvoyance to be able to know for fact what happened, you might know how to score me some easy money too.
Accused three times. Around the third time it starts looking bad. Also, I am not clairvoyant, I read an article last night with the quote from the cop. I will try to find my source.
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Old 12-01-2011, 01:17 PM   #92
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Default Re: Hate that Ravens fans have for the Steelers!!!

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Accused three times. Around the third time it starts looking bad. Also, I am not clairvoyant, I read an article last night with the quote from the cop. I will try to find my source.
3 times is a little shaky. I know of the third one, but that seemed more like a bandwagon accusation than anything else. And not even a hint of a lawsuit or trial even came of it.

And I agree that it looks bad. It looked just as bad for Lewis, evidence or no evidence. He watched his buddies commit murder, and even if he was trying to play peacemaker...that doesn't make a whole lot of difference when you turn around and lie for your murdering friends now does it. That's pretty bad. Doesn't make either of them guilty though (or innocent).

Go ahead and find the source if you want, but it's been nearly 2 years and whatever the cop said or didn't say had no bearing on whether or not there was a trial. Bottom line, the girl dropped the charges. And yes, I understand that doesn't mean nothing happened.

We can go back and forth on both cases and the evidence in them all day if you like, but none of that will change the fact that Ben was never proven guilty of rape (or even charged), and Lewis was never convicted of murder. You can't defend one under the premise of innocent until proven guilty and then hold the other to a completely different standard. That's pure hypocrisy and you know it. All you're doing right now is twisting everything to fit your opinion of Ben being guilty.
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Old 12-01-2011, 02:17 PM   #93
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Default Re: Hate that Ravens fans have for the Steelers!!!

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Accused three times. Around the third time it starts looking bad. Also, I am not clairvoyant, I read an article last night with the quote from the cop. I will try to find my source.
when the first accuser sends text messages to her co-workers bragging about having sex with ben, i guess it's safe to say it wasn't rape

second accuser denies she was raped, and also her story and friends' stories changed about 5-6 times. probably some gold digger in the making, chasing a check because I'm guessing she's too stupid to make i through the college she's attending.

ben's only mistake is messing around with floozies at the bar, who may be after his money. he should stick to dating other high profile women like the golf chick

going out and getting your party on isn't a crime
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Old 12-01-2011, 02:48 PM   #94
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3 times is a little shaky. I know of the third one, but that seemed more like a bandwagon accusation than anything else. And not even a hint of a lawsuit or trial even came of it.
Yeah, the third "victim" was so mortified and distraught, she apparently even went back for more.

"The GBI's month-long investigation into a rape accusation leveled against Ben Roethlisberger uncovered an allegation -- unsubstantiated -- by a second woman that the Steelers quarterback forced himself upon her.

The incident allegedly occurred during a party at Roethlisberger's house in Reynolds Plantation. A young woman not interviewed by authorities claims the quarterback pulled his pants down and told her she could “do whatever she wants," according to the GBI report.

A week later, the woman, believed to be 21 or 22, attended another party thrown by Roethlisberger. She claims the 28-year-old quarterback was drunk and forced his hand up her skirt. She was able to escape and informed her father of the incident but he apparently encouraged his daughter not to pursue a criminal complaint, the report states."

http://www.ajc.com/sports/gbi-report...an-465574.html
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Old 12-01-2011, 03:40 PM   #95
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3 times is a little shaky. I know of the third one, but that seemed more like a bandwagon accusation than anything else. And not even a hint of a lawsuit or trial even came of it.

And I agree that it looks bad. It looked just as bad for Lewis, evidence or no evidence. He watched his buddies commit murder, and even if he was trying to play peacemaker...that doesn't make a whole lot of difference when you turn around and lie for your murdering friends now does it. That's pretty bad. Doesn't make either of them guilty though (or innocent).

Go ahead and find the source if you want, but it's been nearly 2 years and whatever the cop said or didn't say had no bearing on whether or not there was a trial. Bottom line, the girl dropped the charges. And yes, I understand that doesn't mean nothing happened.

We can go back and forth on both cases and the evidence in them all day if you like, but none of that will change the fact that Ben was never proven guilty of rape (or even charged), and Lewis was never convicted of murder. You can't defend one under the premise of innocent until proven guilty and then hold the other to a completely different standard. That's pure hypocrisy and you know it. All you're doing right now is twisting everything to fit your opinion of Ben being guilty.
Think that about sums it up.
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Old 12-01-2011, 03:41 PM   #96
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Yeah, the third "victim" was so mortified and distraught, she apparently even went back for more.

"The GBI's month-long investigation into a rape accusation leveled against Ben Roethlisberger uncovered an allegation -- unsubstantiated -- by a second woman that the Steelers quarterback forced himself upon her.

The incident allegedly occurred during a party at Roethlisberger's house in Reynolds Plantation. A young woman not interviewed by authorities claims the quarterback pulled his pants down and told her she could “do whatever she wants," according to the GBI report.

A week later, the woman, believed to be 21 or 22, attended another party thrown by Roethlisberger. She claims the 28-year-old quarterback was drunk and forced his hand up her skirt. She was able to escape and informed her father of the incident but he apparently encouraged his daughter not to pursue a criminal complaint, the report states."

http://www.ajc.com/sports/gbi-report...an-465574.html
If that article is supposed to defend ben, it was a really bad choice. You're saying if women go to two of Ben's parties they should expect to be sexually assaulted both times? Or that she somehow deserved it? Welcome to three decades ago, we have progressed as a society since then.
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Old 12-01-2011, 03:55 PM   #97
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If that article is supposed to defend ben, it was a really bad choice. You're saying if women go to two of Ben's parties they should expect to be sexually assaulted both times? Or that she somehow deserved it? Welcome to three decades ago, we have progressed as a society since then.
As a women, I can say this with 100% conviction...If I went to a party at a guys house who I thought was sleezy and was trying to do things to me or with me that I didn't approve of, I wouldn't go back.

No one is saying that if something like that happened, that means the girl deserved it or anything...but it's a stupid thing to do.

Yeah, I get your point about 3 decades ago...but another thing that comes with our society now, is that it is much easier for a woman to cry wolf. Look no further than Kobe or the (can't think of the schools name) rugby team allegations. Shit goes both ways, and that's unfortunate because there really are women being raped and violated. Rape is a very hard crime to prove...and a very touchy subject. Adding women giving false accusations now, and it's just a whole shit storm that no man, guilty or innocent, wants to be involved in. I can tell you this though, real rapists usually aren't noticeable assholes (like Ben is or has been in the past). They are usually more like serial killers and try their best to hide their wicked intentions. Criminal chameleons.
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Old 12-01-2011, 03:55 PM   #98
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Default Re: Hate that Ravens fans have for the Steelers!!!

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If that article is supposed to defend ben, it was a really bad choice. You're saying if women go to two of Ben's parties they should expect to be sexually assaulted both times? Or that she somehow deserved it? Welcome to three decades ago, we have progressed as a society since then.
Christ, you're really thick. The point of my posting that article was if she was assaulted in the first damn place, is anyone reasonably supposed to believe she'd put herself in the SAME situation one week later? Also factor in that this allegation came to light when it was open season on Ben Roethlisberger in the media, and, well, you got a pretty suspect story, in my opinion.
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Old 12-01-2011, 04:29 PM   #99
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Christ, you're really thick. The point of my posting that article was if she was assaulted in the first damn place, is anyone reasonably supposed to believe she'd put herself in the SAME situation one week later? Also factor in that this allegation came to light when it was open season on Ben Roethlisberger in the media, and, well, you got a pretty suspect story, in my opinion.
I think you're going down a slippery slope. Let's suppose she was assaulted, and then went to his party a week later. It might be stupid (and college kids can be pretty freaking stupid) but there's no law against stupid. There is a law against assault, and for some weird reason with rape (and pretty much only with rape and related crimes against women) the conversation always turns to what was the woman doing, thinking, wearing, whatever. That's centuries, millennia of machismo bred and beaten into us popping out.

If I got the shit kicked out of me walking to work, no one asks what I was wearing, why I decided to walk that route, if I'm a gold-digger for pressing charges, etc. And if I get the shit kicked out of me a week later walking to work, I might get called snakebitten or cursed, or the cops might start looking into gang activity, or who knows what, but no one calls me stupid or claims I'm asking for it.

People need to check themselves, I guess is what I'm saying. Ben's not worth defending in these matters, and certainly neither is Ray Lewis.
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Old 12-01-2011, 04:30 PM   #100
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Christ, you're really thick. The point of my posting that article was if she was assaulted in the first damn place, is anyone reasonably supposed to believe she'd put herself in the SAME situation one week later? Also factor in that this allegation came to light when it was open season on Ben Roethlisberger in the media, and, well, you got a pretty suspect story, in my opinion.
So. Let's say you go to a party and your friend is really drunk, and he takes a swing at you. Do you never ever see that person again? No, you probably give them the benefit of the doubt, that they were just being a jerk because they were drunk. You don't expect that the next time you go to a party with them they are going hit you over the head with a beer bottle. So yes, I can see her "putting herself in the same situation" again, because that situation is a PARTY. You are trying to portray that as some bizarre behavior, but I don't see it. Maybe her friends begged her to come, maybe she was pressured, maybe she just wasn't expecting to have a hand forced up her skirt, you don't know, and neither do I.


Bottom line: you don't put yourself in a position to be assaulted, and going to someone's party twice is not a green light for them to put their hand up your skirt. So yes, I think she could reasonably assume that she could go to a party without being felt up by Ben Brosephburger.

SCMom, I agree that times have changed and there is no way to say she isn't crying wolf. But I won't agree with this guy that she is lying because she went to the party. To me that does not compute.
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