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Old 12-17-2011, 03:31 PM   #21
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Default Re: Bound and Gagged: Tomlin Giving Into NFL, Tells Steelers To Stay Mum

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Yeah, I think you're absolutely right. Voicing individual opinions to the media on this issue is not an effective strategy for change. The corporate media are going to spin everything to serve their own interests anyway. And if they can't do that, they just won't print it. They only print what's consistent with the interests of owners and elites, because they're pretty much the same people.

The only real bargaining power that players have is through their union. But, as you mentioned, there is a serious lack of solidarity among its members. There are various reasons for this, mainly the enormous disparity in salaries across the league. Getting the union to organize around an ostensibly narrow issue like penalty fines & suspensions is not going to happen unless the players understand what's really at stake. There are broader implications to consider. As a fan on another message board pointed out, imposing huge fines disproportionately protects certain players while hurting others. When you single out for punishment individuals who are only doing their jobs, it has the effect of further weakening solidarity among players and puts the owners in a position to impose further constraints.

That said, fans are right to demand that players step up and speak out against these fines/suspensions, which are highly disruptive. The fans are the players' strongest advocates. If players are serious about opposing these hit restrictions, then the union needs to stand together and make some demands. That's the only way they can raise the costs high enough for the owners to win a compromise. They owe at least that much to the fans.
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Old 12-17-2011, 06:08 PM   #22
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Default Re: Bound and Gagged: Tomlin Giving Into NFL, Tells Steelers To Stay Mum

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Tomlin did not throw anybody under the bus. The insinuations in this thread are absurd. Does anybody seriously doubt whether or not Tomlin "has the locker room"? The same person that came in second in a poll of players about who they would want to play for? Of course Tomlin has the locker room, he's one of the most respected coaches in the league. Every time a player false starts or holds or does anything that gets a flag, he's "playing illegally", and that's a factual statement. Acknowledging after one of your players gets suspended that the hit he got suspended for was against the rules is by no means throwing him under the bus. It would be completely idiotic for a head coach to deny it. And it would be pointless to act like nothing ever happened in your press conference as if questions are not going to be asked about it, Do you really think it would be beneficial for the team if it appeared to the league that the team's head coach doesn't understand the rules and that he's fine with his players giving people concussions? Do you want that kind of attention and scrutiny from the league? Tomlin said that Kemo was playing illegally and that if he doesn't stop he won't get another chance to play too, but I don't hear anybody whining about Tomlin throwing HIM under the bus. Is it because the fans have already done so to such an extent that his body was rent asunder by the tires already?
Well put!

Fact is, Harrison gave a QB a concussion with an illegal helmet to helmet hit. McCoy may miss this week as a result. I don't feel bad for McCoy, it's football, but there is no denying what happened. I'll bet a dime to a dollar that James (and I'd bet Tomlin) was warned the last time that if he did again he'd face a suspension. Not whining to the press is not the same as not being supportive...
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Old 12-17-2011, 07:15 PM   #23
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Default Re: Bound and Gagged: Tomlin Giving Into NFL, Tells Steelers To Stay Mum

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Do you really think it would be beneficial for the team if it appeared to the league that the team's head coach doesn't understand the rules and that he's fine with his players giving people concussions?
Do you know the rules? If so, explain them to us and please give examples of the fairness they have been given out across the board. I didn't say he didn't have the locker room. However, unlike yourself I don't know for sure if players feel the coach should not stick up for his players. it was an open question on a forum to ask an opinion (like yours).

Tomlin has stayed quiet for over a year about the inconsistency of punishment given out by the NFL. My question to you is... Has that been beneficial?
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Old 12-17-2011, 07:34 PM   #24
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Default Re: Bound and Gagged: Tomlin Giving Into NFL, Tells Steelers To Stay Mum

Pretty much what I said, except, a spear to the chest taking goodell off the podium.

He would go down in history as the man with the biggest set. Could he be fined? No, season is over and he reitred, lol.

Yes, Tomlin tossed James under the boss, by commenting before the appeal process was done. He didn't need to comment. He only needed to say, " he will comment when the process goes its course, we stand behind James"

But no, he made stupid comments!
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Old 12-17-2011, 10:34 PM   #25
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Default Re: Bound and Gagged: Tomlin Giving Into NFL, Tells Steelers To Stay Mum

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Do you know the rules? If so, explain them to us and please give examples of the fairness they have been given out across the board. I didn't say he didn't have the locker room. However, unlike yourself I don't know for sure if players feel the coach should not stick up for his players. it was an open question on a forum to ask an opinion (like yours).

Tomlin has stayed quiet for over a year about the inconsistency of punishment given out by the NFL. My question to you is... Has that been beneficial?
Here is the rule: thou shalt not smash a quarterback's face with your face immediately after he throws the ball, even if it seemed like he was going to run. Whether or not the rule is ENFORCED consistently is a completely different subject. But there is no debate that Harrison's hit was illegal. It's not even close. The rule is very explicit about the fact that it doesn't matter if the QB is out of the pocket, if he has just released the ball, he still has 'defenseless player' protection, namely, you can't hit him in the head.

Coaches should NOT "stick up" for their players if by "stick up" you mean "illogically defend an obviously illegal hit". He never said that he agreed that he should be suspended for the hit, he just said that they "accept" the punishment; they don't have a choice but to accept it. If "throwing under the bus" means "acknowledging that a player has been punished and acknowledging that what the player was suspended for actually happened", then yeah, Tomlin threw Harrison under the bus. But that would be a really stupid definition of "throwing under the bus". What exactly was so wrong about what Tomlin said? Can somebody that has their panties in a twist about what Tomlin said about Harrison's situation explain what was so bad and traitorous about it?
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Old 12-17-2011, 10:50 PM   #26
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Default Re: Bound and Gagged: Tomlin Giving Into NFL, Tells Steelers To Stay Mum

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Photo of Harrison and Roethlisberger at NFL league office waiting for their suspension appeal hearings with Goodell
that is GREAT!

tomlin is very smart. he knows when to choose his battles and how to pick them wisely.

if anyone thinks this organization hasnt been supportive of its players (even ben w/the bunk rape allegations) they havent been paying attention.

unfortunately goodell has the steelers under his thumb with the majority of the teams backing him. the rooneys know this, and mike tomlin klnows this.

it is what it is, and will continue to be. you can only fight the system so much.
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Old 12-17-2011, 10:53 PM   #27
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Default Re: Bound and Gagged: Tomlin Giving Into NFL, Tells Steelers To Stay Mum

If you think there was not communication between Goodell and Tomlin before that statement, think again. My guess is there was, and that was a calculated statement by Tomlin. Most public statements regarding the league are not made willy-nilly, they are said for a reason to satisfy an agenda. We do not have any idea what Goodell and Tomlin talked about, and as I said, you can bet they discusses something.

Which makes me angry, because I bet Goodell told Tomling basically what to say or else. Which reinforces my opinion, and many others, that Goodell has a personal agenda, which is separate from his thinly guised veil of player safety.

I don't think he threw Harrison under the bus. I think his statement was in response to what Goodell directed. I am sure Tomlin and Harrison are cool, and Tomlin is with Harrison all the way and supports him on the field, in the locker room, etc. Media generated statements are just that, and as fans, we often base our entire bank of knowledge on those. We have to realize that. They have personal relationship and rapport that even the exalted media, or Goodell, has access to.




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Pretty much what I said, except, a spear to the chest taking goodell off the podium.

He would go down in history as the man with the biggest set. Could he be fined? No, season is over and he reitred, lol.

Yes, Tomlin tossed James under the boss, by commenting before the appeal process was done. He didn't need to comment. He only needed to say, " he will comment when the process goes its course, we stand behind James"

But no, he made stupid comments!
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Old 12-18-2011, 07:18 AM   #28
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Default Re: Bound and Gagged: Tomlin Giving Into NFL, Tells Steelers To Stay Mum

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Can somebody that has their panties in a twist about what Tomlin said about Harrison's situation explain what was so bad and traitorous about it?
The league is to mercurial when is comes to divvying up the punishment. Thats what gets my "panties in a bunch". I find it hypocritical when no one other then the Commish himself has decided to change a game. And don't pull the "player safety" card because this is the same league that didn't want to cover player healthcare after they retire.

So let me get this right, you agree with all the punishment Harrison got handed down? The Brees hit? Is there a good time for a leader to step up to the podium and say "Enough is enough"?
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Old 12-18-2011, 06:06 PM   #29
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Default Re: Bound and Gagged: Tomlin Giving Into NFL, Tells Steelers To Stay Mum

Actually the owners voted on rule changes this past offseason. And Goodell doesn't hand out the fines either.

I never said that I agreed with Harrison's suspension. The Brees hit was kind of dubious because it was a facemask to the back, but I guess by the rules it was the "right" call, despite being lame. The one that was complete bull was the hit on Fitzpatrick. As far as your desire for Tomlin to make some kind of stand, I don't think this is the line in the sand you want to draw just yet.
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Old 12-18-2011, 06:19 PM   #30
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Default Re: Bound and Gagged: Tomlin Giving Into NFL, Tells Steelers To Stay Mum

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Actually the owners voted on rule changes this past offseason. And Goodell doesn't hand out the fines either.

I never said that I agreed with Harrison's suspension. The Brees hit was kind of dubious because it was a facemask to the back, but I guess by the rules it was the "right" call, despite being lame. The one that was complete bull was the hit on Fitzpatrick. As far as your desire for Tomlin to make some kind of stand, I don't think this is the line in the sand you want to draw just yet.
'He did the right thing by keeping quiet. Negative attention is not what we need when we're in good position to take control of the AFC.
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