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Old 09-21-2012, 09:09 PM   #71
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Default Re: Time to stick a fork in Polamalu and Harrison

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Originally Posted by Curtain_of_Steel View Post
I do not think they suck like Ike, but I do think we are watsing money for them to play a half season. Each season its a different reason. Right now its 20million riding th ebench.

Harrisons knee shouldve been dealt with long ago and the FO waited and delayed and let th eplayer call the shots. Thats BS

As far as troy goes, watch him in warmups, there is no warming up prior togames, he tosses a football around, rarely stretches, rarely runs with the team. I"m not sayingthis is good or bad,I'm just bringing up the fact that there is no visible running or stretching prior to a game. Yet always is pulling something,
agreed. We'll never even get close to that dollar-figure out of either one of them again. At some point, both team and fans have to admit the obvious, and start moving forward.
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Old 09-21-2012, 10:04 PM   #72
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Default Re: Time to stick a fork in Polamalu and Harrison

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Originally Posted by FanSince72 View Post

The thing I don't get about Steeler fans in general (and I've been one for 40 years) is the reverence displayed for three people: Chuck Noll, Dick LeBeau and now Troy Polamalu.
How many head coaches won 4 Super Bowls?

How many championships (hell - how many division titles) did the Steelers win before Noll arrived? Before Noll arrived the Pirates were the team in Pittsburgh - that changed for good 40 years ago

I know you may say Noll only won anything when he had great talent - but lots of coaches with great talent (Landry and Madden are 2 examples from Noll's era) did not consistently win Super Bowls

There was this quote about the great Yankees manager Casey Stengel

Critics who denigrate him as a manager like to point out that of the four major league teams he ran, three never finished higher than fifth, and one of those never higher than 10th. It doesn't matter. There is a story about a fine poker player who described a better poker player by saying, "When I have the cards, I clean the table. When he has them, he cleans the room." When Stengel had the players, and the resources to get more, he cleaned the room.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vau...0349/index.htm

When Chuck Noll had the players he cleaned the room - hope that answers your question as to why Noll is revered, if the name of the man who was Steelers coach the year they rose to power and you apparently became a fan does not
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Old 09-21-2012, 10:12 PM   #73
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Default Re: Time to stick a fork in Polamalu and Harrison

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How many head coaches won 4 Super Bowls?

How many championships (hell - how many division titles) did the Steelers win before Noll arrived? Before Noll arrived the Pirates were the team in Pittsburgh - that changed for good 40 years ago

I know you may say Noll only won anything when he had great talent - but lots of coaches with great talent (Landry and Madden are 2 examples from Noll's era) did not consistently win Super Bowls

There was this quote about the great Yankees manager Casey Stengel

Critics who denigrate him as a manager like to point out that of the four major league teams he ran, three never finished higher than fifth, and one of those never higher than 10th. It doesn't matter. There is a story about a fine poker player who described a better poker player by saying, "When I have the cards, I clean the table. When he has them, he cleans the room." When Stengel had the players, and the resources to get more, he cleaned the room.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vau...0349/index.htm

When Chuck Noll had the players he cleaned the room - hope that answers your question as to why Noll is revered, if the name of the man who was Steelers coach the year they rose to power and you apparently became a fan does not
This
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Old 09-21-2012, 11:51 PM   #74
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Default Re: Time to stick a fork in Polamalu and Harrison

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Once again, I'm not saying that Troy has not done some special things or that he hasn't had an impact on the way the game is played.

All I'm saying is that -- In My Opinion -- he hasn't done anything SO special that he deserves a spot on Mount Rushmore.

The thing I don't get about Steeler fans in general (and I've been one for 40 years) is the reverence displayed for three people: Chuck Noll, Dick LeBeau and now Troy Polamalu.
I don't understand why they seem to be regarded as some sort of Supernatural beings.

Yes, they all deserve accolades and they all deserve to be in the Hall of Fame -- but none deserve sainthood. They're just people who are good at what they do but none are "gifts" to football or to humanity and the idea of putting them on pedestals drives me crazy. It's as if this game wouldn't exist if the three of them didn't.

You know, there's a fine line between "fan" and "Fanatic".
Good thing that neither of us is a "fanatic."  

Good thing that neither of us thinks that football wouldn't exist without Troy.  

Good thing that neither of us thinks that football players are essential to the advancement of humanity.  

Good thing that neither of us think that Troy is a saint and/or a supernatural being.

With those hyperboles out of the way, I ask again:  
Could one not say that his "shininess" actually made him exceptional?  
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Old 09-21-2012, 11:55 PM   #75
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Default Re: Time to stick a fork in Polamalu and Harrison

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Hey, maybe he never truly got healthy from that injury. It sure appears that way to me.
Bingo!!!
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Old 09-22-2012, 09:29 AM   #76
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Default Re: Time to stick a fork in Polamalu and Harrison

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Originally Posted by Atlanta Dan View Post
How many head coaches won 4 Super Bowls?

How many championships (hell - how many division titles) did the Steelers win before Noll arrived? Before Noll arrived the Pirates were the team in Pittsburgh - that changed for good 40 years ago

I know you may say Noll only won anything when he had great talent - but lots of coaches with great talent (Landry and Madden are 2 examples from Noll's era) did not consistently win Super Bowls

There was this quote about the great Yankees manager Casey Stengel

Critics who denigrate him as a manager like to point out that of the four major league teams he ran, three never finished higher than fifth, and one of those never higher than 10th. It doesn't matter. There is a story about a fine poker player who described a better poker player by saying, "When I have the cards, I clean the table. When he has them, he cleans the room." When Stengel had the players, and the resources to get more, he cleaned the room.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vau...0349/index.htm

When Chuck Noll had the players he cleaned the room - hope that answers your question as to why Noll is revered, if the name of the man who was Steelers coach the year they rose to power and you apparently became a fan does not
Chuck Noll: Won 4 SB's then stayed for another decade that produced nothing.
But the FO couldn't muster the courage to tell him it's time to go because of his "sainthood" and so we instead endured a decade of mediocre football.

Dick LeBeau: A Defensive genius who changed the way football is played but (like Noll) has lost more than a step in the last five years but will likely die on the sideline because once again his "sainthood" makes it impossible to let him go.

Both of these men were revolutionary and both rightfully achieved legendary status. But the fact is that eventually everything comes to an end and everyone loses their edge. But the tendency in this organization is to live in a state of denial and ignore those facts.

Are you suggesting that Noll retired at the top of his game?
Or that LeBeau still has years of innovation left in him?

I think both of them are the greatest things that ever happened to this team.
The problem is that they were both placed on pedestals too high for anyone to reach and no one wanted to be the one to have to climb up there and tell them that maybe it's time to move on.
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Old 09-22-2012, 11:32 AM   #77
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Default Re: Time to stick a fork in Polamalu and Harrison

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Stop it, lets make a deal Troy and James can get older, lets just say you and I will always stay 30 or at the most 35. I agree, the way Troy plays the game this was meant to happen he came in the league in 2003, it seems as if he has been in the league since 1998 when Hines came in. James has always known one way to play, lights out until (or after) the whistle, he has always taken the challenge and when he was younger seemed to prevail. I hate to say it but these might be two positions the Steelers need to address in the 2013 draft, I really don't see a formidable "player in waiting" to replace either, I was really hoping that kid from Florida State (You know the walking Doogie Howser) would have made the team.
I wish i could stay 30....To late for that already passed that mark.
And yes it seems the Steelers keep hanging onto players that they think will produce forever and yes they should draft next year but dont tell them that.
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Old 09-22-2012, 01:25 PM   #78
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Default Re: Time to stick a fork in Polamalu and Harrison

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Originally Posted by FanSince72 View Post
Chuck Noll: Won 4 SB's then stayed for another decade that produced nothing.
But the FO couldn't muster the courage to tell him it's time to go because of his "sainthood" and so we instead endured a decade of mediocre football.

Dick LeBeau: A Defensive genius who changed the way football is played but (like Noll) has lost more than a step in the last five years but will likely die on the sideline because once again his "sainthood" makes it impossible to let him go.

Both of these men were revolutionary and both rightfully achieved legendary status. But the fact is that eventually everything comes to an end and everyone loses their edge. But the tendency in this organization is to live in a state of denial and ignore those facts.

Are you suggesting that Noll retired at the top of his game?
Or that LeBeau still has years of innovation left in him?

I think both of them are the greatest things that ever happened to this team.
The problem is that they were both placed on pedestals too high for anyone to reach and no one wanted to be the one to have to climb up there and tell them that maybe it's time to move on.

I agree. I"m surprised they had the balls to let Arians go. But you're right for example on LeBeau - no matter what he does, he's untouchable and will stay no matter what the consequences.
I'm afraid of what will happen with Polamalu and Harrison....who also have reached "saint" status with the fans (and rightly so....). But there comes a time..............................
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Old 09-22-2012, 01:29 PM   #79
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Default Re: Time to stick a fork in Polamalu and Harrison

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Originally Posted by FanSince72 View Post
Chuck Noll: Won 4 SB's then stayed for another decade that produced nothing.
But the FO couldn't muster the courage to tell him it's time to go because of his "sainthood" and so we instead endured a decade of mediocre football.

Dick LeBeau: A Defensive genius who changed the way football is played but (like Noll) has lost more than a step in the last five years but will likely die on the sideline because once again his "sainthood" makes it impossible to let him go.

Both of these men were revolutionary and both rightfully achieved legendary status. But the fact is that eventually everything comes to an end and everyone loses their edge. But the tendency in this organization is to live in a state of denial and ignore those facts.

Are you suggesting that Noll retired at the top of his game?
Or that LeBeau still has years of innovation left in him?

I think both of them are the greatest things that ever happened to this team.
The problem is that they were both placed on pedestals too high for anyone to reach and no one wanted to be the one to have to climb up there and tell them that maybe it's time to move on.
I did not say anything about LeBeau

But this is what you asked with regard to Noll

Quote:
Originally Posted by FanSince72 View Post
The thing I don't get about Steeler fans in general (and I've been one for 40 years) is the reverence displayed for three people: Chuck Noll, Dick LeBeau and now Troy Polamalu.
I don't understand why they seem to be regarded as some sort of Supernatural beings.

Yes, they all deserve accolades and they all deserve to be in the Hall of Fame -- but none deserve sainthood. They're just people who are good at what they do but none are "gifts" to football or to humanity and the idea of putting them on pedestals drives me crazy. It's as if this game wouldn't exist if the three of them didn't.
You did not ask me whether Noll hung around too long (he did) - you said you did not get why he was revered

If someone is the greatest thing to happen to an organization (you and I agree Chuck Noll was that person for the Steelers) and it is a successful organization (most Lombardis won by any NFL team would seem to meet that standard) then it is no shock that person is revered by the fan base

I do not think anyone is saying Noll was a gift to football or humanity (if you want to go into that area ask some old time Green Bay fans about Saint Vince), just that Noll, probably even more than the Chief (who was revered even though his team was a joke for its first 40 years), is revered for what followed after he arrived in Pittsburgh
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Old 09-22-2012, 05:01 PM   #80
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Default Re: Time to stick a fork in Polamalu and Harrison

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I agree. I"m surprised they had the balls to let Arians go. But you're right for example on LeBeau - no matter what he does, he's untouchable and will stay no matter what the consequences.
I'm afraid of what will happen with Polamalu and Harrison....who also have reached "saint" status with the fans (and rightly so....). But there comes a time..............................
They let Hines go.  

They let Franco go.  

They let Woodson go (although, that was about money, and about him not wanting to play FS).  

They let Greg Lloyd go.  They let Joey Porter go.  And, similarly, they'll  let Harrison go after this year.  

If Troy can get healthy, who knows.  If he remains injured, he might go very soon.  

LeBeau had the top ranked defense (in yards & in scoring) last year.  Sure, he lost two big games last year (the second BALT game, and the DENV play-off game), but he also had several players injured (eg Harrison & Woodley only played about three games together).  

After a 12 year SuperBowl drought, Noll left Cowher a team loaded with talent (Lloyd, Woodson, Lake).  Cowher took over... and... took 13 years to win a SuperBowl.  Maybe both Noll & Cowher should have gone sooner... or, maybe it's hard to win SuperBowls.  Regardless, I think most teams would have been happy with either of those coaches.  
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