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Old 11-23-2012, 09:05 PM   #141
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Default Re: #1 Defense By Smoke & Mirrors

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Originally Posted by GoFor7 View Post
Like I said earlier, the Steelers don't think like that. They think possession is more important than scoring
now you're just plain being silly...
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Old 11-23-2012, 09:22 PM   #142
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Default Re: #1 Defense By Smoke & Mirrors

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now you're just plain being silly...
He never wasn't.
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Old 11-23-2012, 09:48 PM   #143
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Default Re: #1 Defense By Smoke & Mirrors

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Originally Posted by lipps83 View Post
That's right, I forgot that since the Steelers defense is now #1 in total yards since week 9, the first 5 games do not exist....

Outside of future hall of famer Matt Cassel marching the worst NFL offense since 1929 down the field to tie the game and send it into overtime, they have played great.

Are they playing better? Absolutely. How well they are currently playing is not my argument.

I really don't think I can state myself more clearly than I already have. If you want to read the stat lines and be happy that the Steelers are #1 on a piece of paper, that's cool with me.
Why yes , the first five games still do exist, and it can tell people how much they have improved since.

But you want turnovers and sacks, when I just want the defense to get off the field on third down (which they have done impressively since the first five games). Splash plays will come (interception in OT to win the game is not a splash play?) sacks will come, but to say that this defense needs to do everything for this offense (and special teams) is absurd. The defense allowed 6 offensive points, negated the Ravens' best deep threat, and stifled one of the best running backs in the game. Special teams allowed a punt return for a touchdown and continually left the offense with bad field positioning. The offense could only muster 10 points and two good drives throughout the game. And when the running game got going in the fourth quarter, we nearly abandoned the running game!

The defense did its job in the Ravens game(and in most games since the winning streak started) The offense and special teams needed to step up for this game.
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Old 11-24-2012, 07:27 AM   #144
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Default Re: #1 Defense By Smoke & Mirrors

It's funny on these forums, we have guys who are defensive supporters and people who think the offense can do no wrong. Those people make excuses for the offense if the O plays poorly, like not enough short fields, no turnovers from the D etc.
(hypothetical for you) Our defense could be pitching a shutout allowing less than 150 yards forcing 2 or 3 turnovers, we could be winning 6-0 in the 4th Q despite the offense turning the ball over 3 or 4 times in the opponents end of the field. The other team gets a lucky bounce and scores a TD late to win 7-6. This forum would be lit up, calling for LeBeau's head, Tomlins head and crying how the defense let another one slip away.
Now maybe my example is a bit far fetched but you all get the idea. This offense has all of this talent at WR, all of this speed, sometimes the offense needs to be able to win some bloody games, no matter who is at QB. At the start of this season, reading through these forums, it was almost a consensus...the Offense had to step up and win some games and not rely so much on the D. Well, that has not happened this season as we ahd hoped, yet the defense is getting way to much blame when we lose.
BTW there are three parts to a football game..Offense, Defense and yes special teams, and we have not had a very good year returning or defending on ST. That, my friends is as much to blame for our 6-4 record as anything else. A better effort on ST against the Ratbirds and we win!!
Thats my rant for the day, LOL!

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Old 11-24-2012, 08:29 AM   #145
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Default Re: #1 Defense By Smoke & Mirrors

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Originally Posted by Rick5895 View Post
It's funny on these forums, we have guys who are defensive supporters and people who think the offense can do no wrong. Those people make excuses for the offense if the O plays poorly, like not enough short fields, no turnovers from the D etc.
(hypothetical for you) Our defense could be pitching a shutout allowing less than 150 yards forcing 2 or 3 turnovers, we could be winning 6-0 in the 4th Q despite the offense turning the ball over 3 or 4 times in the opponents end of the field. The other team gets a lucky bounce and scores a TD late to win 7-6. This forum would be lit up, calling for LeBeau's head, Tomlins head and crying how the defense let another one slip away.
Now maybe my example is a bit far fetched but you all get the idea. This offense has all of this talent at WR, all of this speed, sometimes the offense needs to be able to win some bloody games, no matter who is at QB. At the start of this season, reading through these forums, it was almost a consensus...the Offense had to step up and win some games and not rely so much on the D. Well, that has not happened this season as we ahd hoped, yet the defense is getting way to much blame when we lose.
BTW there are three parts to a football game..Offense, Defense and yes special teams, and we have not had a very good year returning or defending on ST. That, my friends is as much to blame for our 6-4 record as anything else. A better effort on ST against the Ratbirds and we win!!
Thats my rant for the day, LOL!

The hypothetical situation which you mentioned was a little extreme, but actually not all that far off from the Ravens game.

-The defense gave up 3 points.
-The special teams gave up 7 points.
-The offense gave the Ravens 3 points (Wallace fumble in the red-zone).

Summation:
The Steelers lose, despite the defense playing very well... and some people overtly blame the defense. Worse yet, some people backtrack & say that they don't blame the defense, yet in the same breath, they blame the defense "because it did not giving the offense a shortened field" (ie making it appear that they are being somewhat rational, when they're just as outlandish as the first type of person).

Anyway, I mentioned exactly those three bulleted points, and was called a drunken Yinzer. Expect to be called a drunken, stupid Yinzer, too.
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Old 11-24-2012, 12:12 PM   #146
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Default Re: #1 Defense By Smoke & Mirrors

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Originally Posted by teegre View Post
The hypothetical situation which you mentioned was a little extreme, but actually not all that far off from the Ravens game.

-The defense gave up 3 points.
-The special teams gave up 7 points.
-The offense gave the Ravens 3 points (Wallace fumble in the red-zone).

Summation:
The Steelers lose, despite the defense playing very well... and some people overtly blame the defense. Worse yet, some people backtrack & say that they don't blame the defense, yet in the same breath, they blame the defense "because it did not giving the offense a shortened field" (ie making it appear that they are being somewhat rational, when they're just as outlandish as the first type of person).

Anyway, I mentioned exactly those three bulleted points, and was called a drunken Yinzer. Expect to be called a drunken, stupid Yinzer, too.
I guess I shouldn't mention that Tomlin said the defense needed to make a splash play in that game in his press conference. But if it makes you feel better, I thought Haley called a poor game on offense. Tried to be too cute at times, especially down near the goal-line.

As for my comments about the offense babysitting the defense, what do you all expect? If the offense is so hell-bent on drives that consume the clock rather than strike quickly, the Steelers will be in too many close games - thus putting more pressure on the defense. With the defense not getting turnovers, and special teams being a complete embarrassment, this offense needs more big plays to make up the yardage.
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Old 11-24-2012, 12:24 PM   #147
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Default Re: #1 Defense By Smoke & Mirrors

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Originally Posted by GoFor7 View Post
I guess I shouldn't mention that Tomlin said the defense needed to make a splash play in that game in his press conference. But if it makes you feel better, I thought Haley called a poor game on offense. Tried to be too cute at times, especially down near the goal-line.

As for my comments about the offense babysitting the defense, what do you all expect? If the offense is so hell-bent on drives that consume the clock rather than strike quickly, the Steelers will be in too many close games - thus putting more pressure on the defense. With the defense not getting turnovers, and special teams being a complete embarrassment, this offense needs more big plays to make up the yardage.
Wait... which is responsible for the loss: the offense or the defense? It sounds like you are FINALLY saying that it's NOT the defense... which has been my only point all along.

Oh... and you now agree that the ST giving up 7 points was also a huge part of the problem. (We are making real strides here.)

In other words, you agree with what I originally stated:
-the defense gave up 3 points
-the ST gave up 7 points
-the offense gave the Ravens 3 points (turnover in the red-zone)

It only took three pages... but again, we're making strides.

As far as Tomlin's comments go: everyone wants more turnovers... even the head coach. I'm sure that he also wanted more TDs by the offense... as well as not giving up a TD on special teams.
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Old 11-24-2012, 01:23 PM   #148
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Default Re: #1 Defense By Smoke & Mirrors

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Originally Posted by teegre View Post
Wait... which is responsible for the loss: the offense or the defense? It sounds like you are FINALLY saying that it's NOT the defense... which has been my only point all along.

Oh... and you now agree that the ST giving up 7 points was also a huge part of the problem. (We are making real strides here.)

In other words, you agree with what I originally stated:
-the defense gave up 3 points
-the ST gave up 7 points
-the offense gave the Ravens 3 points (turnover in the red-zone)

It only took three pages... but again, we're making strides.

As far as Tomlin's comments go: everyone wants more turnovers... even the head coach. I'm sure that he also wanted more TDs by the offense... as well as not giving up a TD on special teams.
This is the first time in this thread you noticed that I mentioned special teams is a joke?

All that alcohol....
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Old 11-24-2012, 01:41 PM   #149
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Default Re: #1 Defense By Smoke & Mirrors

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This is the first time in this thread you noticed that I mentioned special teams is a joke?

All that alcohol....
1. You initially disagreed with me (when I mentioned ST gave up 7 points); instead, you called me a Yinzer.

2. When you finally did indeed acknowledge ST, you added the obligatory "But, the defense should have set the offense up with a turnover." So, we were back to square one: you blaming the defense.

Make sense?

[Please, stop the alcohol references; I don't want to go into specifics, but alcohol jokes strike a personal nerve with me.]
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Old 11-24-2012, 01:50 PM   #150
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Default Re: #1 Defense By Smoke & Mirrors

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Originally Posted by teegre View Post
1. You initially disagreed with me (when I mentioned ST gave up 7 points); instead, you called me a Yinzer.

2. When you finally did indeed acknowledge ST, you added the obligatory "But, the defense should have set the offense up with a turnover." So, we were back to square one: you blaming the defense.

Make sense?

[Please, stop the alcohol references; I don't want to go into specifics, but alcohol jokes strike a personal nerve with me.]
I disagreed about special teams? Hmmm......

Well, Pittsburgh is the capital of knee-jerk reactions when it comes to sports....
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