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Old 01-02-2013, 05:47 AM   #11
WokeUpWithaWoodley
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Default Re: Top seventeen

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The number of sack is a bit misleading to Mingo's case IMO. He still generated lots of QB pressure and helped to make plays. His ceiling is off the limit and I hope the Steelers take a chance on him. Your mention of JPP and Aldon Smith is valid but I don't think Jordan is a reach at mid-first round. If everything goes right, I think he's as good as JPP and Aldon Smith. Also he's a well rounded OLB instead of a pure pass rusher. That would fit in LeBeau's scheme perfectly.
I like Jordan don't get me wrong he's potential is off the charts and I wouldn't mind taking him at 17 I suppose depending who was on the board. But because of jpp and smith we might see a team pick him higher. If we went olb in first I would like to see Moore or Werner but both will most likely be a top 10 pick.

My question to you is how has Jordan been in pass coverage man and zone?
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Old 01-02-2013, 11:37 AM   #12
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Default Re: Top seventeen

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Elam hasn't declared yet and reports say he won't.
If teo is around at the 12th pick I could see us trading up.
The thing about this draft is that there's a few players that would fit the scheme and need of the Steelers that are top 10 picks and others that are in the 22-32 range. So it looks like it will be a year to trade up or down. Most tines I would be against trading down but since there will be quality players in rounds 2-3 I wouldn't mind trading down selecting vaccaro and picking up two bpa in round 2
I was thinking about this, as well. After the top few players, there is a group of about 15-20 that I would not mind seeing as a Steelers.

While I am not more confident than ever that there WILL be a great talent available at 17, I am also convinced that the Steelers could trade down to 24-26 (pick up an extra R2 pick) and STILL get just about as good of a player as they would have gotten at 17.

This reminds me of the 2001 draft, where the Steelers were targeting Dan Morgan. He got drafted, and they traded down (because there was like five NTs drafted that year)... picked up Casey Hampton a few picks later (who they would have gotten at 16, if they had stayed)... and got an extra pick.

Then, the Steelers traded up in R2 (since they now had that extra pick), for an ILB (Kendrell Bell) since they had missed out on Morgan.

So...
Trade back a few spots, with a team desperate for "some" player, pick up an extra pick, and then use that extra pick to trade up in R2 (for one of those third-tier players).

[Note: After that second-tier group of twenty, there is another twenty or so that would grade out as late-R1 players... so, trading up from 47 to even 42 (or 35) would be a great move... if the Steelers did indeed have an extra pick.]
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Old 01-02-2013, 11:46 AM   #13
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Default Re: Top seventeen

I need to get on par with some of you draft board aficionados - Steelers could be very active this draft, maybe even to the tune of a Troy-like draft activity?
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I'VE GOT SOME YOUTHFUL ADJUSTMENTS FOR 'DAT AZZ
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Old 01-02-2013, 01:34 PM   #14
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Default Re: Top seventeen

Speaking of the top tier of players:

21. Dee Milliner, CB, Alabama

He is rated much higher than 21; he will go somewhere in the top 10. But, I forgot to list him. Regardless, he is not (IMO) a targeted position for the Steelers... but, since he's the top CB in this draft, he will push some other player down to the Steelers at 17.

As far as the aforementioned second-tier of players (a group of about 15-20), here are some players who would still be good picks, were the Steelers to trade down (to 22-27).

22. John Hankins, NT, Ohio St.
23. John Jenkins. NT, Georgia
24. Sylvester Williams, NT, North Carolina
25. John Cooper, LG, North Carolina
26. Sam Montgomery, OLB, LSU
27. Eric Fisher, OT, Central Michigan

That said, as you can see, the OLBs would likely be gone (although I think 2 or 3 will drop down, and regardless, there are quite a few R2 prospects), but there are plenty of NTs & O-linemen. I know that most are high on McClendon, but with NT being the key to the 3-4, an upgrade is not out of the question... especially since we do not know the future of Ta'amu.
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Old 01-02-2013, 02:15 PM   #15
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Default Re: Top seventeen

Dion Jordan is the best pure-pass rusher in this draft. He's fast, agile and can get around tackles. He's not as strong as Aldon Smith was coming out and he's a little rough around the edges, but he's going to make a great OLB for us (I truly believe that's who we're taking).

To Teegre's point - the OLB's won't be gone. Okafor, Jordan, Mingo and Montgomery will still be on the board when we pick. I'm leaning toward Mingo if he's on the board because of his high upside and potential, but I can see the argument against him as well. I'm very, very much against taking a NT or OG in the first round (or at all, really) until we see what McLendon and Ta'amu can do when they're given a starting opportunity. To the offensive line, let's get Gilbert - Foster - Pouncey - DD - Adams together and we'll see what happens before we take another linemen in the first round.

I'm leaning toward our first four rounds looking like ..

R1. Barkevious Mingo / LSU - DE / 3-4 OLB
R2. Cordarrelle Patterson or Robert Woods / Tennessee & USC - WR
R3. Robert Lester / 'Bama - SS
R4. Nico Johnson / 'Bama - ILB

Fits our needs and fills older positions with young and explosive guys.

Regarding Manti Te'o - I have a strong, strong feeling that the Saints are going to be taking him at 15. As talented as he is, I say we don't trade up for him. There's better prospects for more important positions we're going to have open to us at 17 and trading up would hinder our reloading process for our defense. If anything, trade down and get Matt Elam in the 22 - 26 range, pick up extra picks and blow the 2014 draft on getting Jadeveon Clowney, but we've already been over that.

We can't go wrong in this draft which is the first time in a long time I've said that.
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Old 01-02-2013, 02:31 PM   #16
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Default Re: Top seventeen

Why is everyone so hot to trot on Te'o?
I really can't see him as a Steeler. To me he just doesn't fit what we do. We attack the QB (in theory)....that really isn't his strength. Please educate me (being serious, not sarcastic) as to why he would fit so well with us? I think we need players that would work well with what we do. For example, Brady is a great player but that doesn't mean he would do well as a Steeler.
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Old 01-02-2013, 02:57 PM   #17
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Default Re: Top seventeen

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Why is everyone so hot to trot on Te'o?
I really can't see him as a Steeler. To me he just doesn't fit what we do. We attack the QB (in theory)....that really isn't his strength. Please educate me (being serious, not sarcastic) as to why he would fit so well with us? I think we need players that would work well with what we do. For example, Brady is a great player but that doesn't mean he would do well as a Steeler.
Te'o is at his best when he's blitzing and getting to the quarterback. While I agree that we need more of a coverage inside backer to play alongside Timmons, Te'o can do that too. While it's not his strong point and he excels at blitzing, he can play zone and man coverage decently enough.
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Old 01-02-2013, 04:09 PM   #18
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Default Re: Top seventeen

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To Teegre's point - the OLB's won't be gone. Okafor, Jordan, Mingo and Montgomery will still be on the board when we pick. I'm leaning toward Mingo if he's on the board because of his high upside and potential, but I can see the argument against him as well. I'm very, very much against taking a NT or OG in the first round (or at all, really) until we see what McLendon and Ta'amu can do when they're given a starting opportunity. To the offensive line, let's get Gilbert - Foster - Pouncey - DD - Adams together and we'll see what happens before we take another linemen in the first round.

We can't go wrong in this draft which is the first time in a long time I've said that.
O-LINE
I think that it all depends on what the Steelers plan to do with Starks, Foster, and The Colon. If ANY of those three is brought back, then the O-line is essentially set. If Starks comes back, maybe Gilbert plays LG. If The Colon or Foster comes back, Gilbert plays LT.

Even if none of those three returns, the Steelers they could possibly go with this as a line:
Gilbert - Beachum - Pouncey - DD - Adams

That said, since they "could" have already used that line-up this past season, and instead moved Pouncey to LG, it tells me that they are not comfortable with this as their starting five. If all three players (Starks, Foster, and The Colon) leave, then a LG becomes a position of need.

I am not saying that the R1 pick should be an O-lineman, but it would not be the worst pick. More importantly, if they do indeed go OG in this draft, it needs to be a R1 pick; otherwise, it would not be an upgrade over their current roster.

Regardless, three of those O-linemen (Warmack, Lewan, Joekel) WILL go in the top 16, which will push a LB down to the Steelers.

NOSE TACKLE
I am a huge fan of Ta'ama. (We've discussed how I followed him in college, and that I felt that he was the steal of last year's draft.) Butů his future is a huge question mark.

And, I think that McClendon needs to be given a chance.

Lastly, much like the O-line, if the Steelers do indeed decide to go NT in this draft, it needs to be a R1 pick; otherwise, it would not be an upgrade over their current roster.

CAN'T GO WRONG
I agree. There is going to be a ton of LBs (OLBs & ILBs) from which to choose. Even Kenny Vaccaro... or trading down. This is going to be a good draft. [/B]
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Old 01-02-2013, 05:16 PM   #19
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Default Re: Top seventeen

I really do think our best option will be to trade back and acquire another 2 round pick because like teegre said there a late First rounders that would be available in round 2.

As far as what position to draft I feel like our biggest needs are ilb, safety, olb, wr, oline, rb, corner in that order as of right now we will see what happens in the offseason as many of this will for sure change.

The reason for for ilb biggest that is our biggest question mark heading into the season. We don't know if foote will come back and if he does it will be for one more year. Spence is a question mark because no one knows what he will be, I tend to look at him as more of a Timmons type player not someone for our right ilb position but time will tell. It has to be addressed in the first 2 rounds maybe 3 if someone falls.

Safety would be my next priority because we all know we need to find replacement Troy and Clark. We currently have no backups on the team that project to be the potential starters, I've heard they like golden but we need a top notch playmaker back there.

Olb I think we all know there was little production from them this year and Harrison likely has one more year. The reason I but this 3rd is Jason worlds till the last game led our team in sacks in limited playing time. I do value him because he wasn't bad this year when he played he also was coming off wrist surgery and this offseason will get full strength back and will be lifting nomally, so I think he will be a quality starter. Also spence could maybe play there but that's all a big if.

As for wr, Wallace will be gone so someone fresh to bring in to compete will be needed, rb depending on what we do with mendy redman and dwyer. Online could also use good players because Gilbert injuries all of them.

Based on what I think our needs are I would

Trade back in first a select a guy like Kenny vaccaro or Elam if he declares. Vaccaro would be a great pick because he could backup Troy and Clark for a year or two learn the defense and learn from two greats at the position. This is also a huge value pick because at Texas he would often cover the slot wr and did it very well. So you get a good safety who could come in the first year and play the nickel slot position which will be needed if Lewis leaves and Allen takes the second cb spot

What every we get trading back I think we should use it to acquire 2 picks in round 2 or if we get a round 2 out of it move up with trading a 4th away.

There are so many players that are potential starters and good starters in this league that will go round 2 IMO. If we go safety round one. I believe it would be time to look at lb in round 2 and there are many options. A guy like chase Thomas olb Stanford would be a good pick, skov ilb Stanford, Gerald hodges penn state and many others as I'm sure we will discuss closer to draft.

But I really love Gerald hodges most places have him as a round 3 guy but I believe he will go sooner than that. I feel like he will be a mold of narravo bowman sf linebacker. He had great production in college I think he had 3 seasons will 100 plus tackles. He's projected olb but I believe he would be a great inside guy which he played in his junior year if I'm not mistaken. He will be available when we pick in the second and would provide great value being a guy who can play both line backing position. And we all know Tomlin loves guys who can play multiple positions.

Also I have posted before if we lose Wallace I would like us to pick up quinton Patton wr for la tech. If you don't know who he is look him up. Potential first round cb banks from Texas a&m said he was the best wr he faced all season. I would select this guy in the ack part of round 2 or early part of round 3.

As of right now I would be really happy with vaccaro, hodges, and Patton as our first three picks, none are big name picks but will be quality starters in this league.
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Old 01-02-2013, 05:24 PM   #20
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Default Re: Top seventeen

And for the nose tackle debate I don't believe pick one this year unless its round 5 or later. McClendon has shown us that he can be the starter and he provides a little pass rush ability that Hampton did not. And the cause from tammau I loved this kid in college and thought we should of taken him in round 3 and was really upset when we passed on him be extremely happy he was there in the fourth. As far as his arrest a feel like he will stay on the team I mean they must really like him and see him as a great player to keep him around after what he has done.
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