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Old 01-14-2013, 01:40 PM   #1
PATS16N0
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Default How will posterity remember Peyton?

First of all, despite all the hate for Tom Brady, from fans and media, I believe this man will get his due on the day of retirement by even his most jadded critics and be regarded as the best of all time..

But what about Peyton?

Peyton was always the quarterback everyone wanted to succeed.
In fact, I have never seen an NFL player whose media-legacy and on-the-field play have such a wide disconnect from one another.

Peyton just gets lavished with rose peddles each and every season.
This year he moved to a "more complete team" than both Brady and Rodgers were on, and put up inferior statistics than both quarterbacks, yet was discussed for the last 8 weeks of football as the obvious MVP winner.

I mean, every time the media talks about him they turn into North Korea.

Peyton became the quarterback with the most all time QB losses in post season history (ironically, on the same weekend Brady separated himself from Montana with 17 wins) against Baltimore. He now also has the `record` for most first round eliminations with 8.

Think about this.
In the 2000's the AFC South was trash. It was Peyton Manning and a bunch of crappy expansion teams (Texans, Jags, Titans). Mark Sanchez could get to the first round of the post season in this division. And now the AFC West.

Say what you want about the AFC East but Miami was a post-season team during our Dynasty, the Jets are a strong defense and went to two back to back AFCCG's, and its a mute point anyway because the Pats win in the post-season.

Peyton has basically been in a situation his entire career where it would be impossible NOT to make the play offs, then once there he was immediately kicked out of them in his first game.

Peyton is a true system quarterback. He even brought his one system with him from Indy to Denver. Once he faces good teams, he gets shut down, then he clams up, then he tosses interceptions. Even his one Superbowl year came with a post season performance of 3 touchdowns and 7 interceptions. In other words, his defense carried him. The Patriots stripped their offense down to the bare-bones in 2006 before the '07 reload, and still barely lost the AFC Championship game in Indianapolis, allowing Peyton to proceed.

I say when it's all said and done, all this "GOAT" talk of Manning fades with his retirement and he goes down in history as somewhere on the bottom of a top ten all time list, and nowhere near the top of it.
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Old 01-14-2013, 01:42 PM   #2
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Default Re: How will posterity remember Peyton?

unless Brady wins any more SB's all he's going to be remembered for is spygate and being defeated twice by Eli Manning.
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Old 01-14-2013, 01:45 PM   #3
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Default Re: How will posterity remember Peyton?

Quote:
Originally Posted by harrison'samonster View Post
unless Brady wins any more SB's all he's going to be remembered for is spygate and being defeated twice by Eli Manning.
lol. I know with such certainty that that ALREADY isn't the case, I'm not gonna' even bother to argue the point
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Old 01-14-2013, 01:55 PM   #4
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Default Re: How will posterity remember Peyton?

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Originally Posted by NEPatriots View Post
lol. I know with such certainty that that ALREADY isn't the case, I'm not gonna' even bother to argue the point
Riiiight.
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Old 01-14-2013, 02:10 PM   #5
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Default Re: How will posterity remember Peyton?

Brady will not be regarded as the equal of Montana unless he wins another Super Bowl

After the 2004 season I thought Brady might win around 6 Super Bowls - has not turned out that way has it now?

Post-2004 Brady has had his share of disappointing losses too
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Old 01-14-2013, 02:18 PM   #6
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Default Re: How will posterity remember Peyton?

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Brady will not be regarded as the equal of Montana unless he wins another Super Bowl

After the 2004 season I thought Brady might win around 6 Super Bowls - has not turned out that way has it now?

Post-2004 Brady has had his share of disappointing losses too
He does need a 4ing ring, I agree. But he also has 2 more conference championships than Montana, too.

I think if anything what I've learned in watching the trials and tribulations of New England since the 2006 season is that it's very hard to win a Superbowl. Very hard.

Green Bay was probably expecting Rodgers to win six, too, all last season while he was steam rolling people.
Two back to back divisional round losses.
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Old 01-14-2013, 02:53 PM   #7
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Default Re: How will posterity remember Peyton?

I still think up through 2009 Peyton was better than Brady. Obviously since then he's been on the decline and Brady clearly hasn't, but to me the Peyton Manning up to the end of the 00's was an all-time great who didn't have enough of a supporting cast to win as many SB's as he should have. He had complete mastery of his offense and team and made throws I thought were simply impossible. Not that Brady didn't either but to me Peyton's control and mastery of his passing attack was on another level...where Brady executed well for the Patriots, Peyton WAS the Colts, if that makes any sense (it probably doesn't but I'm having trouble putting my opinion into words). The 09 Super Bowl loss to Brees, to me, marked the end of Peyton's reign as the best QB...he's still playing well but at nowhere near the level he was back then. But, in short, I will remember him for his fantastic career as a Colt, regardless of whether he ever wins with the Broncos or not.

Then again, I'm one of those people who still argues Marino was better than Montana despite the lack of rings, so maybe I just have a soft spot for great QBs who didn't win many championships.
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Old 01-14-2013, 03:02 PM   #8
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Default Re: How will posterity remember Peyton?

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And it’s not like he’s entered the playoffs with bad teams, folks.

Quite the opposite. He’s consistently entered the playoffs with GREAT teams. The 2005 Colts, for example, were 14-2, No. 2 in scoring defense and the AFC’s No. 1 seed. They failed to win a single playoff game, losing to Pittsburgh, 21-18.

The 2007 Colts were 13-3, No. 1 in scoring defense and the AFC’s No. 2 seed. They failed to win a single playoff game, losing to San Diego 28-24.

And, of course, the 2012 Broncos were 13-3, No. 4 in scoring defense and the AFC’s No. 1 seed. They failed to win a single playoff game, too.

Notice a trend here, folks?

Naturally, Manning reserved one of his worst performances of the year for the playoffs:

28 of 43, 290 yards, 6.7 YPA, 3 TD, 2 INT, 88.3 rating

It was Manning’s third-lowest-rated game of the entire 2012 season: 58.5 vs. Atlanta and 83.0 vs. Houston – all three of his lowest-rated games losses. That's how it works in the NFL, folks. QB puts up great numbers you win. QB doesn't and you lose.

In 14 of 17 games this season, including all 13 wins, Manning posted a passer rating better than 90, including 10 games better than 100. But in the biggest game of the year, he was once again merely ordinary.
http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com...manning/20801/

He's had plenty of great teams. He's had teams a hell of a lot better than the 2011 Patriots, that's for sure. That team was gaping with holes.
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Old 01-14-2013, 03:06 PM   #9
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Default Re: How will posterity remember Peyton?

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Originally Posted by PhantomJB93 View Post
I still think up through 2009 Peyton was better than Brady. Obviously since then he's been on the decline and Brady clearly hasn't, but to me the Peyton Manning up to the end of the 00's was an all-time great who didn't have enough of a supporting cast to win as many SB's as he should have. He had complete mastery of his offense and team and made throws I thought were simply impossible. Not that Brady didn't either but to me Peyton's control and mastery of his passing attack was on another level...where Brady executed well for the Patriots, Peyton WAS the Colts, if that makes any sense (it probably doesn't but I'm having trouble putting my opinion into words). The 09 Super Bowl loss to Brees, to me, marked the end of Peyton's reign as the best QB...he's still playing well but at nowhere near the level he was back then. But, in short, I will remember him for his fantastic career as a Colt, regardless of whether he ever wins with the Broncos or not.

Then again, I'm one of those people who still argues Marino was better than Montana despite the lack of rings, so maybe I just have a soft spot for great QBs who didn't win many championships.

Nailed it. It's easy to forget that Brady also has one of the best, if not the best coach of all time. If Peyton was in New England and Brady was in Indy, you could probably swap how many rings they have.

Brady is far and away better than Peyton in the playoffs, and as of right now is the better QB, but I don't know how you can call Peyton a "system" QB when Brady has put up numbers when Belichek has given him an amazing offense. Granted, Peyton had some studs too at one point, and both Brady and Peyton make the people around them better, but New England has had multiple years now where opposing defenses flat out can't match the personnel that the Patriots offense has.

They are both great. Brady will go down as being better, but it's not as if he is far and away better. To me, Brady will go down as the second best post season QB of all-time, and they will both go down as top 5 overall.
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Old 01-14-2013, 03:15 PM   #10
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Default Re: How will posterity remember Peyton?

Peyton is a great regular season quarterback. He'll win you games and win division titles, but he won't win you playoff games. 8 one-and-dones in the playoffs is bad. If his name wasn't Peyton Manning, we'd look at that stat and say 'average quarterback'. Sure, he's been to 20 playoff games - that's great. Winning 9 of them isn't.

One of the arguments that was just erased in this postseason was 'If Peyton had a defense like the Steelers, he'd have 5 rings!'. I'd argue against that point until I was blue in the face and often times, my friends who are Peyton and/or Indy fans would be flustered too. It would get heated by the end of it, but these playoffs just erased that point. The Broncos had a top 5 defense and a top 5 offense. His defense was playing stout football and were arguably the best defense left in the playoffs at that point. What happened, though? Peyton did as Peyton does and came up un-clutch in the playoffs. The simple fact of the matter is, Peyton Manning isn't that great when it matters most.

One of the biggest boosts that Brady has is, who did he win a Super Bowl with? Can you name a receiver that Brady won with? He was able to put up ridiculous numbers and play at such a high level without any true supporting cast. He made those receivers who they were and took a bunch of no-names to the Super Bowl and won. Three times. Peyton had Reggie. Montana had Rice. Brady had ... Givens? Branch?

Brady has always been and will always be the better Quarterback. Peyton should be remembered as the guy who couldn't get it done when games actually mattered, but he won't be.
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