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Old 02-06-2013, 07:43 PM   #21
lloydwoodson
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Default Re: Chad Brown calls Lewis overrated

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Originally Posted by BleedPurple View Post
Like I said, 2 is arguable as I think Butkus, Lambert, and Singletary are all in that conversation. But I'm arguing against someone who called him above average to very good, who you will notice has not chimed in with his list of 10 all time that are better, because you run out of choices that make sense when you get to 3 or 4.
You can add Willie Lanier, Ray Nitschke and Junior Seau to the list.
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Old 02-06-2013, 09:43 PM   #22
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Default Re: Chad Brown calls Lewis overrated

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lol, you can go back to 1896 if you want, there aren't 10 players better at MLB, not even arguably. I would argue there aren't 2 other players better at MLB, but that is definitely arguable as it gets crowded at the top.
10 might be a stretch, but he did say LB and you changed it to MLB. So you can definately add LT to the list along with Butkus, Singletary, Lambert.
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Old 02-06-2013, 09:49 PM   #23
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Default Re: Chad Brown calls Lewis overrated

I might slide him in around #5 as I can't really say about the older guys. Only other guy in the Super Bowl era I can think of would be Derrick Thomas, but I think Lewis edges him out.
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Old 02-08-2013, 07:52 PM   #24
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Default Re: Chad Brown calls Lewis overrated

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everybody's entitled to their opinions. He's goes down as great - and i don't disagree with it - due more in part to his leadership attributes & popularity than his play on the field. I i don't even know how that can be disputed.
And his play on the field was no question above average/excellent.

And for the record, i have always liked Lewis, many times defending him and saying he would have been a great Steeler, while listening to others trash him on here. I just don't drink this "greatest ever Kool-aid". Once again, i don't disagree with Chad Brown.
To say that there are "plenty" of linebackers who "wipe the floor" with Ray Lewis sounded like the haterade to me. You can criticize his play somewhat in later years, but in terms of a career body of work I don't see how there is any room for discussion. Ray Lewis is an all-time great.
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Old 02-09-2013, 01:00 AM   #25
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Default Re: Chad Brown calls Lewis overrated

Ray Lewis continued to be a big part of the D almost to the end. His abilities did diminish greatly the past couple of years though. Most noticeable was his slowing down. He didn't get into the backfield quite as fast so there were fewer tackles for losses and he could not cover quality tight ends like he used to. Lateral movement wasn't as good either. The blocks weren't shed quite as quick as he used to either. Instead of tackles for two or three yard gains they were for four and five yards; which add up a bit quicker.
However he still was a good contributor (and not just as a leader) and a quality player. He did not hurt the defense when he played. Last year at the Texans game (I happened to be there lucky me) he made two huge plays in the 2nd half, nailing Foster for a seven yard loss and forcing TJ Yates to run out of bounds instead of scrambling for a first down (it was him vs Yates alone on the outside and Yates went out instead of challenging Lewis). Lewis played well against both the Colts and the Broncos. Not so well against the Pats (their quick dink and dunks are hard for slower and older D guys to cover) or the 49ers (Vernon Davis one of the best and Ngata going out was devastating) but he and the other guys played the goal line stand well. No doubt about it.
Lewis (and Suggs as well) probably should not have been playing these playoffs what with their arm injuries (and Suggs achilies). The only reason Lewis and Suggs played this year was because the Ravens came so close last year that they thought a Superbowl was a real possibility this year and voila. If the team was in rebuilding mode Suggs probably would have chilled for the year and Lewis would have called it quits last year. Sorry for the book report.
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Old 02-09-2013, 09:47 AM   #26
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Default Re: Chad Brown calls Lewis overrated

for a guy that says team team team, he sure likes it to be about him.
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Old 02-09-2013, 01:25 PM   #27
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Default Re: Chad Brown calls Lewis overrated

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i don't disagree w/Chad.

As a team leader : second to none, a fantastic motivator
As a media darling: absolutely top notch, great for attracting publicity to the team and to the city (and to himself - nothing wrong with that). Look at ESPN's top plays of the year for 2012 (at least the list i watched on their highlight reel 2 days ago). Lewis comes through the line and tackles a RB one-yard behind the line of scrimmage. Nothing spectacular, nothing we don't see 2 or 3 times a game from every team, every game - but because its "Lewis" it makes a top plays of the year reel. Some guys got flattened 5 yards behind the line, much more dynamic plays, and they don't even show up on these "lists".

As a linebacker : above-average to very good, no question. But there's plenty of guys who are, and who have in the past, wiped the floor with him at LB in comparison

I like Lewis but i'm really disagreeing with all this "best ever" stuff - by far.
Are you talking about his whole career or just these past three or four seasons? He is easily one of the best to play the game, regardless of position. Above average? Yeah, I hope you're talking about his recent play.
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Old 02-09-2013, 08:22 PM   #28
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Default Re: Chad Brown calls Lewis overrated

I agree that Lewis got a lot of padded stats by being the 3rd guy in on a tackle and getting credit. Also, the years of self promotion and media hype adds to any being overrated.

For the list of LB's better than him...yes you can add guys like Lawrence Taylor, Derrick Thomas, Jack Ham or Ted Hendricks, but they were guys that played more on the outside, but it seems narrow minded to just say the top ILB's in the game.

Butkus, Singletary, Lambert, Chuck Bednarik, Junior Seau, Ray Nitschke, Willie Lanier, Brian Urlacher, Sam Huff are all guys that you could argue are as good if not better. One could argue that Urlacher and Seau are just as good, if not better than Lewis....but they didnt dance every time they entered the stadium, nor preach to teammates every time the camera is on.

Is Ray Lewis top 10 ILB of all time? Yes.
Did Ray Lewis play to the cameras? Yes.\
Did Ray Lewis conspire to conceal a double homicide and have it swept under the rug by the NFL and media? Yes!
Is Ray Lewis overrated? Yes!
Is Ray Lewis a Hall of Fame player? Yes!
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Old 02-12-2013, 12:29 AM   #29
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Default Re: Chad Brown calls Lewis overrated

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I agree that Lewis got a lot of padded stats by being the 3rd guy in on a tackle and getting credit. Also, the years of self promotion and media hype adds to any being overrated.

For the list of LB's better than him...yes you can add guys like Lawrence Taylor, Derrick Thomas, Jack Ham or Ted Hendricks, but they were guys that played more on the outside, but it seems narrow minded to just say the top ILB's in the game.

Butkus, Singletary, Lambert, Chuck Bednarik, Junior Seau, Ray Nitschke, Willie Lanier, Brian Urlacher, Sam Huff are all guys that you could argue are as good if not better. One could argue that Urlacher and Seau are just as good, if not better than Lewis....but they didnt dance every time they entered the stadium, nor preach to teammates every time the camera is on.

Is Ray Lewis top 10 ILB of all time? Yes.
Did Ray Lewis play to the cameras? Yes.\
Did Ray Lewis conspire to conceal a double homicide and have it swept under the rug by the NFL and media? Yes!
Is Ray Lewis overrated? Yes!
Is Ray Lewis a Hall of Fame player? Yes!
Question: How do you overrate a top 10 all time MLB? Because once you are in that convo it is a subjective choice.
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Old 02-12-2013, 05:01 PM   #30
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Default Re: Chad Brown calls Lewis overrated

Do I like Ray Lewis? Answer hell to the no. Do I think his stats have been padded some? Yes to the WTH. Is Ray Lewis one of the top five LBers of all time? I have to say yes. Along with L. Taylor, Butkus, Singletary, Lambert, Nitschke, and others are all-time greats and Ray deserves to be mentioned with them. Never liked saying one player is or was the "best ever". Had several arguments about Tiger Woods with some young golfers who never seen Jack in his prime, while I never saw Ben Hogan in his or Bobby Jones. Different eras produce different legends.
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